Avenger proposal

JimBob55 · Post by **JimBob55** » Fri Mar 11, 2005 12:58 pm

I've done some internet surfing and have learned that George Bush was flying a TBM-1C when he was shot down in September of 1944. The 21C Avenger is the correct version to represent this. I think that this aircraft would be a great representative of the Pacific theatre standard paint scheme. Plus it would have the added popularity of its relation to a future president. Here is a link to Accurate Minitures showing some details: http://www.internethobbies.com/internet ... ghbua.html

Here's a great link to Navy photos of the San Jacinto, showing TBM-1Cs of late 1944: http://www.navsource.org/archives/02/30.htm

21Century's "Lost Patrol" idea would represent the late all-blue color scheme while retaining the correct TBM-1C version.

I know I'm putting the cart way before the horse, in that the first release of the 21C Avenger is a few months off. But I guess I'm excited at the possibilities!

JimBob

tmanthegreat · Post by **tmanthegreat** » Fri Mar 11, 2005 1:33 pm

That would be a very likely possibility - especially for an exclusive release to BCA or some other small retailer like Boyington's Corsair was. I could see that version of the Avenger (as well as one patterned after a Flight 19 aircraft) as being very popular. On a somewhat darker note, Bush's could be tied in with the book "Flyboys" as George Bush Sr. was involved in the campaign to knock out the Chichi Jima radio station and was shot down near the island, narrowly escaping capture...

Gunner · Post by **Gunner** » Fri Mar 11, 2005 1:36 pm

While a good idea, I would rather see a generic paint job first, and I, personally, would rather see an Atlantic paint job for anti-U-boat work than a Pacific paint job, but, to each their own.

The one good thing is the Bush Sr is not seen as a polarizing figure anymore, so the press coverage could be pretty favorable (or not, just depending on what's going on that particular week).

Post by **p51** » Fri Mar 11, 2005 1:45 pm

We have the George Bush TBM paint scheme on our Avenger at the Planes of Fame Museum:

JimBob55 · Post by **JimBob55** » Fri Mar 11, 2005 2:35 pm

Wow, great photos! Thanks for sharing!

I agree about the Atlantic scheme as the first release. I think 21C made a good selection backed up with good research to use the ASW Avenger. The proposal above is for followup repaint possibilities. Always fun to put up for discussion.

I also like the idea of the generic color with the national markings only. Include a selection of decal numbers, etc. to make your own. Much like how the F-18 Blue Angel and the F-16 were offered.

Thanks for the feedback! I'm a Navy aviation nut, so I'll show up mostly with the Corsair and Avenger discussions. Always hoping for a Wildcat, Hellcat, maybe even a Dauntless???? If they are starting on Korean jets, maybe a F9F Panther?? (It is fun to dream....we are looking at a great future of new releases and many more suprises, I'm sure)

Thanks,
JimBob

tmanthegreat · Post by **tmanthegreat** » Fri Mar 11, 2005 3:21 pm

Thanks for the pictures, P-51! Looking at the real thing makes me want the XD plane even more! The Avenger has been one of my favorites for quite a while. I remeber seeing one distinctly as a 7 year old at an airshow - it was big, blue and had that cool turret!

The Bush paintscheme (as evidenced by the pictures posted on this thread) is pretty generic - only the name below the cockpit would distinguish it from all the others. Although he came from a wealthy family, Bush Sr. was simply just another Navy pilot when he served in WWII and there was nothing terribly special about him.

JOC · Post by **JOC** » Fri Mar 11, 2005 6:13 pm

Amen: Nothing special about him now either.
Lets get some planes without the Bush's being plastered on them.

Waltz41 · Post by **Waltz41** » Fri Mar 11, 2005 6:21 pm

21st century made a wise decision in doing the atlantic scheme first. everyone and their mother wants this avenger produced, and most people would probably pick a pacific scheme over the atlantic....so.....market the 'new' avenger everyone wants in the scheme most people might not buy as a second or third repaint......this way...more people are likely to jump at the avenger being released and then also jump once a pacific scheme is released as well. this is a blanket generalized statement of course, as i'm sure some of you would argue you'd rather the atlantic scheme....but you can see my point i hope!

brian

Website · Post by **Teamski** » Fri Mar 11, 2005 7:14 pm

I prefer the Atlantic scheme. It just looks cool and the Avengers were really effective against U-boats.

-Ski

tko211 · Post by **tko211** » Fri Mar 11, 2005 9:23 pm

I think they could do it in hot pink as a first scheme and still sell them! People sure seem to want this plane and my bet is when the first one comes out and you see it in person.... kiss 40-50 bucks good bye! This 1:18 bird is IMPRESSIVE when you see it live and in person.

JimBob55 · Post by **JimBob55** » Sat Mar 12, 2005 9:23 pm

Here's an interesting website which covers the battle of the escort carriers off Samar in the Phillipines. The Avengers were not set up with anti-ship torpedoes and attacked the Japanese ships with bombs or no ordnance at all. Supported by the Wildcats with only their guns. Enjoy....
http://www.bosamar.com/airsqn.html

JimBob

Rogue · Post by **Rogue** » Mon Mar 14, 2005 9:01 am

Escort! is a Pic taken from a TBM-3E

http://community.webshots.com/user/rogue_le

Plastic Spastic · Post by **Plastic Spastic** » Mon Mar 14, 2005 1:35 pm

I'd like to see a three color (glossy sea blue over intermediate blue over non-specular white) scheme, an overall glossy sea blue scheme, and an Atlantic grey over white scheme. The pacific colors are more widely known but the atlantic would look so cool; lighter colors show off the tasty surface detail better.

As for the Bush version; I think they could get away with that without ruffling too many feathers; Monogram Revell is issuing a Swift Boat with Kerry's markings, and Bush Sr. is much less inflammatory to some than his son or Kerry might be right now.

21st needs to continue its series of obscure jets with an F-102 from the Alabama ANG with the added feature that you have to send away to Texas for the Bush pilot figure. I think both sides of the issue have bben through enough that they would think it humorous.

Seriously, the detail on that avenger from Toy Fiar is pretty phenomenal. Fi those guys can make a Wildcat with working retractable wildcat landing gear, then they can do anything.

tmanthegreat · Post by **tmanthegreat** » Mon Mar 14, 2005 3:03 pm

Plastic Spastic wrote:I'd like to see a three color (glossy sea blue over intermediate blue over non-specular white) scheme, an overall glossy sea blue scheme, and an Atlantic grey over white scheme. The pacific colors are more widely known but the atlantic would look so cool; lighter colors show off the tasty surface detail better.

Those should be deffinite repaint possibilities and I agree with the atlantic scheme looking so cool. Thats the one I want. 21c could also do an interesting-looking British Royal Navy version. This has the British roundels and invasion stripes they like to put on their aircraft so much. Here's a couple of shots I found of a restored version:

...and for all you XD collectors from Canada [listening Aferg?], 21c could make a firebombing Avenger, like what are used to put out Canadian forrest fires

Plastic Spastic · Post by **Plastic Spastic** » Mon Mar 14, 2005 3:05 pm

That UK version is pretty cool, and somebody bought the British Corsairs, so who knows. Since I can't use this fact anywhere else, I'll mention here that the Brits called the Avenger the Tarpon.

Post by **p51** » Mon Mar 14, 2005 4:51 pm

A few shots of the RAF version -

Another blue tone:

Post by **aferguson** » Mon Mar 14, 2005 5:14 pm

hmm........never seen a wanter bomber version of the Avenger up here before. Mostly Twin Otters and Canadair CL215's put out Canadian forest fires....and help put out some American ones too. Lots of cross boarder cooperation where forest fires are concerned; i guess the idea is to rather put it out on your land than ours.

I wonder if 21c will do a brit version of the Avenger....my hunch is no. The british corsair didn't do very well and this is bigger, so....

Boy i can't wait for the Avenger, heeeeeee...

Rogue · Post by **Rogue** » Mon Mar 14, 2005 5:34 pm

I think we need to change P51's name to F-6!

Awesome Recon.

victory · Post by **victory** » Mon Mar 14, 2005 6:51 pm

Great recon by P51 indeed, but I really don't expect less. He has been at this since Dec. 7, 1941. Just look at when he joined the board.

Post by **p51** » Mon Mar 14, 2005 10:56 pm

Ha ha, FINALLY someone notices!!

I've had that on there since the boards were started here.

Small Scale Military Headquarters