Avenger

pickelhaube · Post by **pickelhaube** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 4:50 am

Hey Guys,
Any idea if the newer Avengers will be out at Wal-Mart ? I know the Atlantic version did not seem to go over well down here . They put them all on sale and they disapered over night. Will they go on the shelves or should I just forget about it and look up the e-tailers?

Killerf6 · Post by **Killerf6** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 8:18 am

The atlantic avenger as well as the flight 19, avenger never made it to the WM in my area. As a matter of fact one of the WM in my AO no longer carries 1/18 aircraft at all.

Aviatornut.com · Post by **Aviatornut.com** » Fri Sep 14, 2007 5:18 pm

I don't believe that the Avenger will be at WM again. at least that is what has been told to us retailers. i hope this helps.

normandy · Post by **normandy** » Sun Sep 16, 2007 6:45 am

I don't know about walmart but the Atlantic version Avenger never made it to the ATLANTIC / East Coast. I think its odd that the North East and Long Island for that matter never got the Avenger, after all Long Island was home to the Grumman Corp. Growing up here everyone knew someone who worked for Grumman.
My Wifes Dad flew in Avengers during WWII. When I told Him 21st was going to make a 1:18th version, He said when? and "I want one" He never got an Avenger, He passed away a year ago yesterday.
YA gotta love walfarts...... Lets send product to parts of the country that don't want it and the hell with the parts that do want it!

pickelhaube · Post by **pickelhaube** » Sun Sep 16, 2007 9:23 am

normandy wrote:I don't know about walmart but the Atlantic version Avenger never made it to the ATLANTIC / East Coast. I think its odd that the North East and Long Island for that matter never got the Avenger, after all Long Island was home to the Grumman Corp. Growing up here everyone knew someone who worked for Grumman.
My Wifes Dad flew in Avengers during WWII. When I told Him 21st was going to make a 1:18th version, He said when? and "I want one" He never got an Avenger, He passed away a year ago yesterday.
YA gotta love walfarts...... Lets send product to parts of the country that don't want it and the hell with the parts that do want it!

Normandy,
This is sad . I feel your pain for you and your father in law. Years ago I was comissiond to make a C-123 Provider for a customers farther in law. He flew them in Vietnam. I made it from scratch in about 1/72 scale. There were no models for it at the time. They gave it to him on his birthday. According to my customer ir braught tears to the eyes of his father in law. This was the best compliment that I have ever gotten for my work. It was horrible that the Avenger never arrived in Wal-mart in your area.
Matthew

Rogue · Post by **Rogue** » Sun Sep 16, 2007 11:02 am

normandy wrote:
My Wifes Dad flew in Avengers during WWII. When I told Him 21st was going to make a 1:18th version, He said when? and "I want one" He never got an Avenger, He passed away a year ago yesterday.

My Uncle Ern flew Hellcats (F6F-5P) from CVE's during the War.
I just got him a BBi Hellcat for this Xmas.
I was worried it wouldn't make it out in time.
Can't wait to see the look on his face.

normandy · Post by **normandy** » Sun Sep 16, 2007 4:40 pm

Pickelhaube and Rogue, thanks for the kind words. My Father in law was as bad as us... any news on the Avenger? Whats the hold up? I'd tell him, Dad there seems to be some kind of problem with its wings or something. He'd say something in German (and I don't think it was very nice) and then say "I don't have Forever" I got a kick out of that.
Matthew, that is truly the best Compliment You could ever ask for.
Rogue, thats going to be one great Christmas for him.
Thanks guys, John

STUKA · Post by **STUKA** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 10:35 pm

Instead of creating a new thread - I just found the first Avenger one - anyway - I just put together my atlantic Avenger (with our move - everything has been pretty much boxed up) but man this thing is huge.
My plan is to hang it in my son's room so she can make a torpedo run for his bed.

Funny thing is I am so afraid to hang it and even try to fold the wings - it seems more fragile than I expected. If I keep the bomb doors open will there be a problem with the torpedo falling out?

tmanthegreat · Post by **tmanthegreat** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 11:23 pm

There shouldn't be a problem with the torpedo falling out. On my plane, I actually had to sand the pegs on the torpedo's mounts in order for them to fit. Also, I share your opinions about the Avenger being a bit more fragile than needbe. Still, the plane is huge and very well detailed - a true milestone for 1:18 aircraft

vmf214 · Post by **vmf214** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 7:04 am

Atlantic Avengers in SW MO and NW AR sat around forever till went on clearance, then still took about a month for all of them to disappear..

popeye357 · Post by **popeye357** » Thu Nov 22, 2007 4:49 am

I never even got to see one on the shelf:(

krieglok · Post by **krieglok** » Thu Nov 22, 2007 5:57 pm

Every other WM store in the Northern NJ area had them. The store in my town didnt, but the WM in the next town over had eight of them. Their appearance was sporadic and like mentioned above, they sat until they went on clearance, then they disappeared. It was probably Ebayers taking them ands selling them one at a time - my hypothesis at least.

TJ

Website · Post by **Teamski** » Fri Nov 23, 2007 7:32 am

vmf214 wrote:Atlantic Avengers in SW MO and NW AR sat around forever till went on clearance, then still took about a month for all of them to disappear..

This really is a crying shame. The Avenger is 21st's crowning achievement, hands down. The work that went into it and the results were spectacular. It ticks me off when people can't see a work of art even when it it hits them in the face!!

The Avenger stands above all other 1:18 aircraft IMHO.....

-Ski

Sabrefan · Post by **Sabrefan** » Fri Nov 23, 2007 8:41 am

Sorry Ski, I have to disagree with you on the 21st Century Avenger. Everyone I have has had some major problems out of the box. I had to put together quite a few things on the Flight 19 avenger model. I still like the model, I just don't think it is 21st Century best work.

tmanthegreat · Post by **tmanthegreat** » Fri Nov 23, 2007 11:56 am

It is certainly a shame that the Avenger sales at Wal Mart were so un-spetacular. I blame it on poor distribution. As duly noted, many areas got tons of Avengers, while others got nothing. NONE of the seven Wal Marts in my area ever got one from either the first or second generation of Atlantic Avengers. All that despite the fact that they showed up in bulk elsewhere in my state. So, it was Wal Mart that really dropped the ball on the Avenger sales at mass retail

Secondly, however, I agree with Saberfan that there were a ton of QC issues on the Avenger that were not present on other 21c aircraft released around approximately the same time. These really detracted from the model. The most intact Avenger I found was the first-generation "Atlantic" version that I snagged at a WM outside my area on a road trip - and it was missing the screw covers. The fixed Atlantic Avenger I got from BadCat had droopy wings, the Flight 19 Avenger arrived with a cracked canopy and misprinted markings and paint scratches. These are not the fault of the retailer, but rest entirely with 21c.

Do not get me wrong, the Avenger is indeed a great plane

Just that there were a number of precautionary measures that 21c DID NOT take that could have improved the plane. For starters, it should never have been sent in a wobbly plastic tray, secured by only a minimum of twist-ties in a window box. 21c didn't even do that with their first waves aircraft, and those were smaller fighters! I think the manner in which the Avenger was packaged accounts for many of the QC problems. The plane is too big, heavy, and awkward to travel safely in its current box setup without risking paint damage, broken parts, etc. caused by bouncing around and rubbing against the twist-ties. The plane would have been safer, perhaps, in a protective box like that of the P-38, or at least better secured in the window box using either more ties, plastic sheathing and a sturdier, more form-fitting plastic tray.

Those are just my thoughts on the Avenger. I rate it as one of the cooler planes in 1:18, but cannot quite give it the title of 21c's signature (therefore best) aircraft. I guess that's due to all the anticipation only to recieve a less-than-perfect result. If I did rate the Avenger as the greatest achievement in 1:18, then in light of what I've said above, it would only be a hollow victory for a company that perhaps got too big for its britches

olifant · Post by **olifant** » Fri Nov 23, 2007 12:39 pm

I agree with T-man on the distribution. I never saw any of these at WM until right before last Christmas when only one out of five WMs in my AO got them. When they did it was about two pallets worth that went straight to clearance at $39.99.

WM has incredibly flexible sales systems in place that can show how product placement, area and even weather impact sales. This probably works great for tomato sauce and antacids but if applied to things like model airplanes it may do us a disservice.

For all we know the first shipment went to only one state and showed poor sales. This may have translated to a "lets dump this slow selling crap off" decision which led to poor distribution and sales.

My thought is if each store had received five or six they would have sold them. But what is one WM to do with two pallets?

Coreyeagle48 · Post by **Coreyeagle48** » Mon Nov 26, 2007 10:25 pm

Greetings:

The Avenger situation was the same for me. The suburb Walmarts where people would probably have bought them got one or two at the most if any. Some of the Walmarts in the worst parts of my area economically where people need the money for groceries rather than toy planes got about 20 Avengers. If that weren't enough, one Walmart put the whole pallet in the middle of the aisle and everyone hit the planes with their carts and wrecked most of the boxes, in another case, all the planes were put on the top shelf, out of reach and you could never find a Walmart employee to get one. Go figure.

Although the Avenger is big and neat in many respects. I must say it was a quality control disaster in many respects. Some of the examples I saw should have never left the factory as they had some of the worst paint jobs I have seen on anything. The packaging that 21st used was also a disaster, that box was too large and way too flimsy to hold up to a big plane like that and it showed. The windows got broken, parts went missing, etc. I often wondered how many got returned and where the defective ones ended up.