Huey Door gunner question

lsc1002 · Post by **lsc1002** » Thu Oct 12, 2006 8:27 am

Has anyone put a M60 in the door of their CAV Huey? If so how did you do it? Anyone have any ideas?

flpickupman · Post by **flpickupman** » Thu Oct 12, 2006 9:01 am

Well, you could always do it the way it was done before they installed dedicated mounts. They used to be hung from the top of the door frame with bungee cords. That should be easy enough to rig.

Post by **aferguson** » Thu Oct 12, 2006 11:21 am

the 'C' model Huey, as represented by the 21c model, virtually always had the door guns hanging from a bungee. The larger 'D' model commonly had the pintle mounted door guns but the 21c huey really isn't big enough to install them and still have a realistic amount of access area for the cabin.

Birddog · Post by **Birddog** » Thu Oct 12, 2006 11:45 am

Some of the B and C models did use mounts called Sagami mounts. These mounts were made to swing away from the door area for ease of loading and unloading. I have the Squadron UH-1 Huey Gunships book with great reference photos of this mount on some B and C models. However with the small space you have and the limited posing you have of the figure to sit inside the cabin, the bungee chord is a better method and will probably give a more realistic look. The Sagami mounts do look cool.

Razor17019 · Post by **Razor17019** » Thu Oct 12, 2006 12:21 pm

Birddog,
Any way you coudl post a pic of the Sagami mounts? I don't think I have seen this one...

Birddog · Post by **Birddog** » Thu Oct 12, 2006 12:27 pm

I'll try to. I may have to scan them in from the Squadron book. It is a rare mount because I have tried to find pics on the web to post here and I haven't had any luck. I'll try to have them up some how by this weekend.

dfoos · Post by **dfoos** » Fri Oct 13, 2006 2:37 am

Uhh, I know you guys are gonna say, Where's the picture. I promise I'll get it up in the next day or so. I created a custom mount out of spare parts. It's definatley not historically correct, but it gave me a way to mount the thing and still give room for the gunner to sit behind the gun, I used the rear mount that came from a german hanomag (that I had extra) and put a curcular swivel that I cut from a .50 cal tripod (BBi I think) and that allowed one of the .60's that came with the seal mutt to mount. I had to do some cutting and glueing, but what I liked about this is the mount has a flat clip on the base so it fits into the crack where the floor of the huey meets the side just to the side of the bench without permanently altering or having to glue the thing to the chopper. The arm swings out and in and the .60 swivels as well making it pretty easy to put in any position.

Ok, Ok, I'll get the pics up tomorrow.

Birddog · Post by **Birddog** » Fri Oct 13, 2006 5:11 am

Great thinking dfoos. The Sagami mount I've been mentioning that was on some B/C model Hueys is smiliar in shape and design to the one on the back of the Hanomag. From what I can tell from the pictures, it was attached to the Huey either in the same area of the external armament pylon or the pylon itself. I'm going to try to get some pictures posted this weekend for everyone.

tderespino · Post by **tderespino** » Fri Oct 13, 2006 7:09 pm

I did this custom a while ago,, I wanted a HU1D so I extended the cab and added a seat and custmized a m60

momaw nadon · Post by **momaw nadon** » Mon Oct 16, 2006 8:32 pm

I would be interested in that Sagami mount too. If I remember correctly it was attached to the external armament pylon, just under the pylon between the air frame mounting points.

One thing I would like to get a good picture of is the harness the Door Gunners had when manning the M60. I know they used them with the Bungee cord mount. Not sure on the others though. Plus it seems that the only good pictures you find are all of the M23 armament mount for the UH-1Ds. I used to have a book that had some great pictures of the Bungee mount, but alas I must have lost it. There was one picture I remember from the book that had both Bungee mount door gunners firing towards the same side, just one was out on the skid and firing underneath the Huey. Great picture and it must have been taken from another Huey in close by, because it was very clear and sharp. I need to find it again, because I want to add the Bungee mounts to my UH-1C Gunship.

momaw nadon

Folkwulfe · Post by **Folkwulfe** » Tue Oct 17, 2006 7:07 am

I can answer some of the questions about the harness worn by door gunners. I modified a 1/6th 21C OH-6 Cayuse to "realistic" B model specs. As part of that conversion, I added all the details in the aft compartment (overlooked by 21C) including a door gunner and all his associated gear. The harness they wore was commonly called a "Monkey Harness"...the gunner would apear like a monkey on a string if he fell out! The harness itself was a FAST harness also used by Spec Ops folks and resembled a four-point harness with straps over both shoulders and between the legs. Loops in those straps allowed a standard pistol belt to secure them around the waist. Where the straps crossed on the wearers back, there were two "D" rings that were connected to a cargo strap, the other end connected to a cargo tie-down inside the aircraft. The strap was usually no longer than about 6-8 feet. This allowed the gunner to reach up to the skid and pull himself back in if he fell out, which happened more often than some of them like to admit. One guy I know that was a crew chief told me about "surfing the air" where they would lower themselves below the skid and body surf the air while the bird was in forward flight. You had to be careful or the slipstream could slam you up into the belly of the bird. Made a loud bang that really upset the pilots thinking something went wrong or they were receiving fire. Both cause the pilot to made wild manovers that just slamed you into the bird that much more, more loud bangs, and more manovers. Another guy used to scare the hell out of pilots by climbing on top of the cabin just below the rotor disk and crawl forward till he could look down through the windshield and wave at the pilots.
The bungee chord mounts were fairly simple. Two chords were attached in both upper corners of the door opening and a "V" formed when both were attached to the M60. If one broke, the other still offered some support and the gun didn't go "overboard". I haven't got any pics of the Sagami mount that I know of, but I'll look some more and post what I can find. If you need, I have copious pics of the Cayuse conversion including all the gunner stuff.