Panther "Red 332" question

[dragon53]

I just ordered the 21st Century 1/18 Panther "Red 332"---does anyone have any info on this Panther's unit history?

[ostketten]

I just ordered the 21st Century 1/18 Panther "Red 332"---does anyone have any info on this Panther's unit history?

I just took a close look at mine and I don't see any kind of unit or divisional markings on it. Without something like that to go on, I think it would be pure speculation. Maybe someone else has some info on this though...??

[normandy]

I ordered 2 from Bad Cat the other day. As Ostketten has said, without markings on the tank itself its difficult to say.
Uh Dragon, I don't know if you've seen Monkey Depots site today...............but They have Panthers at $24.95!!!!!!!

[Der Kommandant]

I believe this Panther is depicting the same vehicle as the FoV 1/32 edition.

[dragon53]

NORMANDY:

Thanks. I ordered mine from Monkeydepot.
I'm still curious if the Red 332 fought on the Western or Eastern Front.

[dragon53]

According to SSHQ photos, the Red 332 was part of the 13th Panzer Division in Russia in 1943.

[Panzer_M]

yea but a late G..wouldn't have seen a sun in 1943.

[dragon53]

PANZER_M:

So do you have any unit info on Red 332?---I always try to find some history on the models I buy, but the history of Red 332 is evading me.

[GooglyDoogly]

It's a made up scheme. It seems like 21st did a 5-minute google search on German turret numbers and just copied whatever that captured their fancy.

Heck, I wouldn't be surprised if they copied those numbers directly from the 503rd's Tiger 332.



See how eerily similar they are?

[dragon53]

GOOGLYDOOGLY:

I think I remember seeing a post on SSHQ with a reproduction from a reference book supposedly showing artwork of Red 332 and being on the Eastern front, but I'm not sure about that. If you ever come across any info that might shed some light on if Red 332 ia a real tank or not, I'd appreciate it.

I got my Panther today and it is a typical 21st Century tank---glue oozing out of the gun mantlet, spare tread broken off and I barely inserted the commander figure into the hatch and the "tub" compartment broke off (I saw very little glue on the tub compartment to attach it to the turret---maybe the factory workers used all the glue on the gun mantlet). The Panther, like the Tiger I, would have been a much better model if 21st had weathered it.

It's a good deal at Monkeydepot---but it's sure not worth the $100 at Badcat.

[GooglyDoogly]

It's not a good indication when you google "Panther tank 332" the only result that comes up is the 21st 1/18 Panther...

I would like to see that reference pic though. It'll be interesting if its actually a late Panther G, and not an A or a D model, considering the time frame they gave was mid-'43...

When it comes to German turret numbers, particularly Panthers and Tigers, King Tigers, etc, you can usually tell which unit a particular tank belongs to. Each unit, company, platoon, etc have different way of painting their numbers. The shape, the color, even the size of each number is usually a good way to ID a tank.

[dragon53]

GOOGLYDOOGLY:

Here's the link--post is by JAGDPLASTIC.
The Panther's paint scheme in the book is different from the 21st Panther--just the "332" is the same. Maybe you're correct that the 21st Panther Red 332 is fictitious.

viewtopic.php?t=10933&postdays=0&postor ... r&start=20

[dragon53]

PS---As I said earlier, the 21st Panther is a good model at Monkeydepot's price, but it's not worth Badcat's $100. Fortunately, I have some other tank models I like a lot---my FOV 1/16 Sherman, Dragon 1/35 King Tiger-Porsche and my lpint-sized Hobby Master 1/56 M1 Abrams.

[GooglyDoogly]

Thanks for the link! I think I missed that pic post.

Yep, that's a D model. The 21st 1/18 332 Panther is fictitious then.

Even though they're similar, there's so many obvious difference between the late G Panther and a D Panther that it would be odd to paint one up as the other.

Kinda like the difference between the P-51B/C Mustang, vs an H version. Or comparing an IPM M1 Abrams, vs an M1A2 SEP Abrams.

Congrats on getting a 1/16 FOV Sherman! I hope to get one soon, but I'm focused on finishing a "Super Sherman" first.

[dragon53]

GOOGLYDOOGLY:

Thanks for the definitive info. I prefer models with a history and was hoping that Red 332 was a real tank...but it only cost me $25.

[GooglyDoogly]

Meh, I wouldn't worry too much about it. 21st's Panther is a fairly accurate Panther G, altough a little simplified. Hell, it's better-looking and more accurate than the 1/18 King Tiger, judging from the pics I saw of it.

And you're right, $25 is a damn good price for one. And if you really need historical accuracy, you can always repaint it (or commission someone) to make it look like a particular Panther.

[dragon53]

GOOGLYDOOGLY:

The Red 332 Panther looks a lot better than my 21st Century 1/18 Tiger I---the Panther's paint scheme is darker and a lot better looking.
I wish 21st had weathered the Panther---that would have made it a truly impressive model.

[grockwood]

"but I'm focused on finishing a "Super Sherman" first"

GooglyDoogly, is this a mod you are working on or a kit?

[GooglyDoogly]

"but I'm focused on finishing a "Super Sherman" first"

GooglyDoogly, is this a mod you are working on or a kit?

I got a custom T-23 turret kit in order to transform my old 1/16 M4 105mm HVSS Sherman into an 76mm Easy-Eight.

*EDIT* I probably shouldn't have used the term "super-sherman", because it sounds like i'm building an Israeli M50/51 tank.

[Heer]

[normandy]

Thats a very interesting find.

[Heer]

FYI, this panther is not part of the 21st panzer division, don't be mislead by the giant words. Although it claims to be pictured in France of 1944.

[PanzerArm]

Hard to tell precisely if this is the tank FOV meant to replicate as there are several differences.

The liberation flags all over the buildings behind it indicate it is in France, as opposed to Germany like FOV's claims to be. The name on the building behind it, "La Croix" would also indicate France. Reading the caption, it mentions Dompaire, a town in Lorraine, which some major engagements took place in Sept. 1944. After looking up the history of the battle, Panzer Brigade 112, which this tank belonged to, was engaged in a battle there on 12-13 Sept and was virtually wiped out. More specifically, this tank belonged to, as the caption reads, 3 Komp. of the I./29th Panzer Regiment. This would appear to be correct as they were attached to Panzer Brigade 112 during this time. It was only after this battle that all of Panzer Brigade 112 was disbanded and integrated into the 21st Panzer Division (Sept. 23, 1944).

Also there is the matter of zimmerit. The tank in this picture most certainly had it. Zimmerit was put on tanks up until Sept 1944, and saying that this tank was in the field fighting at that time, it most certainly received its factory application. Obviously, FOV's version does not have zimmerit. Now if this is an oversight on FOV's part or whether they are trying to portray a different tank is hard to tell. I for one have always wondered the history behind this tank, and now that we're all talking about it it has kind of re-invigorated that curiosity.

If FOV is trying to portray the tank in this picture with their "332" they apparently failed to do any research...

-Kevin

[Heer]

I think FOV decided to cut corners with this tank, like their S2 panther, which photographic evidence suggested that it had tracks on it's turret. The three-tone camo and spotted version on the tank suggests France or even Denmark.I don't think that a germany 1944 panther tank would have that kind of camo. The only times that a panther didn't have zimmeret would be in kursk of 1943 and the battles in germany, ardennes, up to the fall of berlin. Me thinks FOV cut some corners. I hope that if FOV releases and 1/32 panther it would be with zimmeret.

[Heer]