Contest?

Col.Pickle · Post by **Col.Pickle** » Wed Jul 04, 2007 3:33 pm

alright so as of now I think there should be 3 contests: a)1/18 b)1/35-1/32 and c)1/48-1/72. Each one has its prize. And as to coreyeagles idea of having prizes 4 everyone I think that'd be way too expensive, however we could have a small prize for 2nd. Also its a good point that some people only collect certain theatres. That is why I am proposing havig a theme that is not theatre specific. ie. an after the battle theme, with lots of casualties and bombed out stuff and destroyed vehicles, etc. Wadda you all think of that?Because that theme can apply to any theatre. And also customizing is as gray an area as some of your heads.

So I think we shuld just allow all customizing. That'd jsut make it simpler. Please tell me what you think. I'm rearing to go here

MIGMADMAVIS · Post by **MIGMADMAVIS** » Wed Jul 04, 2007 3:53 pm

I love it!! Lets do it, cause I can think of alot of great ideas!!! and by the way, Col.Pickle, im going up to Williams lake B.C Canada for a fishing trip so im just hoping for some good weather. Sorry to get off topic, but yes this contest sounds like a great idea!!!

-Tobin

Col.Pickle · Post by **Col.Pickle** » Wed Jul 04, 2007 4:36 pm

ummm when you say let's do it do you mean the theme or the contest??? And by the way the weather in BC (at least where I live) is HOT! I think its 39 outside right now. I don't know what its like in Williams Lake though.

conteaddict · Post by **conteaddict** » Wed Jul 04, 2007 4:46 pm

sounds great but i dont know about the theme, neways i'd love to enter in the 1/32 and 1/48 scale contests.

lightning2000 · Post by **lightning2000** » Wed Jul 04, 2007 4:50 pm

Hello,
Coreyeagle raises some good points. With that in mind, I would like to propose the following themes so they arent geo-centric or tied to any one epoch:

Assault - The diorama has to convey the concept that one side is attacking a prepared position in non-urban terrain and the other side is defending

Ambush - The diorama has to convey the concept that one side is launching a surprise attack against a convoy or other similar type of advance where the supposed attacker is clueless that they are stepping into a trap

Beach Assault - Same as the first "theme", however, now the attacker is assaulting a well defended beach

Movement to Contact - Both sides are advancing towards a common goal, say a bridge or some other choke point, with both sides have roughly equal forces

Urban Battlefield - street fighting in a built up area where one side is attempting to reduce the defender's position while the other is attempting to hang on

Delaying Action - as its name implies, the defender, vastly outnumbered, is attempting to slow or impede the advance of the attacker with minimal forces so that other forces can withdraw in good order

Your thoughts?

Lightning2000
www.themotorpool.net

Coreyeagle48 · Post by **Coreyeagle48** » Wed Jul 04, 2007 5:25 pm

Lightining

I like your themes. But I think the following themes might be a good one and open up a lot of possibilities

Preparation-Sides or a particular side is preparing for battle. Could involve readying gear, equipment, you name it. I think this might be a neat theme to explore.

Transportation-You gotta move something, this theme should show men in the process of loading, unloading or transporting equipment. Think this might also open up some neat ideas.

By the way, I don't have gray hair, I am a redhead, LOL. Glad my points were of some help, just want to make sure everyone is on the same page and we have considered everything before moving forward and getting into full swing. Always good to define the rules and plan for the unexpected.

Corey

Col.Pickle · Post by **Col.Pickle** » Wed Jul 04, 2007 6:12 pm

wow those are all great ideas. But I still like mine

But I thikn it'd be cool to have a whole bunch of different themes that you can choose from.

blurx7 · Post by **blurx7** » Wed Jul 04, 2007 7:25 pm

Wow, so many themes!
Maybe no theme at all, but just a good back-story to whatever the diorama entails. Perhaps points could be given based on various areas, such as composition, back-story, scenic elements etc. All to make it easier for the judges to reach an objective decision.
Again, I suggest three judges be agreed upon, and then let them work out the rules.
Another question: is retouched photography allowed? A little photoshop goes a long way. Personally, I would vote not to allow retouched photography, again, to keep the playing field even. That's the same reason I vote against customization. Some are expert in these areas and thus would enjoy an unfair advantage against others.
Still, though, I would think all of this should be worked out by the judges and then the rest of us could just accept whatever they come up with.

Col.Pickle · Post by **Col.Pickle** » Wed Jul 04, 2007 7:32 pm

aaaak so many ideas bouncing around

hurts my head

Okay I think we have to pick our judges before anything else. LIGHTNING2000 WOULD YOU BE A JUDGE? DOES ANYONE ELSE WANT TO BE A JUDGE?

Coreyeagle48 · Post by **Coreyeagle48** » Wed Jul 04, 2007 7:34 pm

Geoff:

Good comments on the photography. Nowdays with the digital cameras and the photo editing software it is very easy to retouch photos on the computer and such. But then again, if someone is an expert at retouching photos, how will we know because their work will be so good. LOL. P-51 is the photography expert here but I agree, no retouching should be allowed on photos.

Just like customization of things, either you can or you can't do it. Allowing certain things and not others will set up some issues. Especially if someone would win and something was done that was questionable.

But then again, it would be the judges decision.

I think you are on the right track though. Once the judges are picked they can work out the rules of the contest and then they can give everyone who is particpating the rules. Those that don't agree with them will simply not particpate in the contest. I would hope though that the rules would be workable enough to get lots of people entered in the contest.

I know one of the other contests there were only 5 entered if memory serves correctly. With everyone on this fourm, we should have at least 20 for this contest, if not more.

Regards

Corey

KAMIKAZE · Post by **KAMIKAZE** » Wed Jul 04, 2007 9:14 pm

I'm in whatever you guys decide on.

Mark

Jay · Post by **Jay** » Wed Jul 04, 2007 10:09 pm

Count me in if there is still going to be a 1:18th catagory. In terms of "themes", maybe we could just set a checklist. As in, the diorama must contain at least: 1 man made object eg wall, sand bagging, building, implacement. 1 natural object eg tree, hedge, cliff. 1 vehicle of some description (self propelled). 1 figure. Should be historically faithfull (markings, equipment) bla bla bla.....

1958Zelda · Post by **1958Zelda** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 12:09 am

Hope we can enter all,and more than one in each scale class,can not wait

DrMindbender · Post by **DrMindbender** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 1:12 am

Looks like you have a list of names already but, if ever you need someone else to help out as a judge, i will volunteer as i won't be participating in the contest. Looks like it will be a very nice contest indeed.

Col.Pickle · Post by **Col.Pickle** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 10:56 am

OK, so we have 2 judges then. We need one more. Once we have the judges I say we let them pick the themes. We can offer suggestions of course but the final decision is up to them.

warhawker · Post by **warhawker** » Thu Jul 05, 2007 11:36 am

My two cents on this is that maybe it should be broken down into Theater of Operations like European, North African, Pacific, etc. That way we could fit whatever themes within these categories mentioned?

Col.Pickle · Post by **Col.Pickle** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 10:33 am

lol warhawker your a little late. We started out with that idea but then someone reminded us that some people only collect certain theaters so that would be unfair. However we could have 2 different theaters to choose from...
Remember people we need one more judge!!! any takers?

warhawker · Post by **warhawker** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 10:38 am

Col. thanks for given me the heads up. I was behind!

Col.Pickle · Post by **Col.Pickle** » Sat Jul 07, 2007 8:29 am

NP. There is alot of posts on this topic. But we STILL need one more judge! Let's get this contest going! I wanna do it during summer when I have time.

Col.Pickle · Post by **Col.Pickle** » Sat Jul 07, 2007 6:33 pm

woah no posts ALL day. Guess everybodys outside enjotyinh the sun.

Coreyeagle48 · Post by **Coreyeagle48** » Sat Jul 07, 2007 7:04 pm

Greetings

I would think personally that some people may have more time to work on things during the wintertime as many people are cooped up in the house and don't have much to do. That's true here in PA, it gets cold in winter, I really don't want to go outside.

Basically no matter what time you have the contest, it isn't going to be the best time for someone. I just hope we get lots of people to enter this time around.

Corey

blurx7 · Post by **blurx7** » Sat Jul 07, 2007 8:43 pm

If Coreyeagle and Dr. Mindbender want to be judges, I will make a third if Lightning doesnt want to participate. I pm'd him but have not heard back, due, no doubt, to his being on vacation.
When he returns, should he wish to judge, I will be happy to not have to be involved.

I suggest that the themes be left open to individual choice, in order to allow and encourage large participation. Someone wants to do Pearl Harbor...fine. Someone wants to do air combat over Berlin...fine. Someone wants to do Iraq, or Sinai, or Stalingrad, or the Bulge or even WWI trench warfare...fine. Whatever gets them going.

I changed my mind about customization. I now believe we should allow any customization at all, again to maximize participation.

I suggest a set of criteria for judging, to include points given for different categories. For example:
creativity, realism, originality, use of scenic elements, historical accuracy, detail, back-story, use of vehicles, background etc. adding up to a total of 100 possible points. Each judge would simply grade each entry with, for example, 6 out of 10 for creativity, 5 out of 10 for realism etc, thus giving each entry a numerical score out of 100 possible points. That way it won't matter what theme they use. The judging will be universal. I like this idea, because it equalizes things a little. Someone who is very clever with figuring out a cool and unique setting or story but who doesn't have the realism/customization skills will still have a shot. And vice versus. We allow everyone to play to their own personal strengths.
If we achieve a tie at some point we could refer to Lightning as a tie breaker.

I believe "trick" photography and "photoshopping", if detectable, should be cause for disqualification.

Three contests, each in a different scale as outlined before.

Time limit? Good question. What do we need from kickoff to deadline? One month? Three months? A year? A week?

Ideas? Comments?

Coreyeagle48 · Post by **Coreyeagle48** » Sat Jul 07, 2007 10:23 pm

Blurx7 has some good ideas.

I am interested in this contest and willing to assist in any way I can however I do not wish to be a judge. I do not feel I am at all qualified to be a judge in this type of stuff. There are many people on this forum who have much more experience and skill in seeing custom work and doing it themselves. I think it should be really those people that do the judging and have some sort of experience in the field.

In all honesty another reason I do not want to judge is by glancing at the timeframe of the contest we are looking at, it may be ending right when everyone starts heading back to school. As a teacher, the first few weeks are usually very hectic and busy for me at school. I am also going to be teaching a different grade this year so I know I will have a lot on my plate. I do not think it would be fair to be a judge when I could not take the time and care in judging the entries. I respectfully decline to be a judge in the contest but am willing to help in another way if you have a need for me to do so.

In terms of retouching photos, I agree it should not be allowed but for example, if you crop a photo of an outside diorama to cut out your kid's swing set, I don't think that should be a cause for disqualification. I think a disqualification for a retouched photo should be some effect or trick that delibrately enhances the entry.

The use of customs is a tough call. I'll leave that to the people who are going to be judging.

Corey

Jay · Post by **Jay** » Sun Jul 08, 2007 3:12 am

mmmm, this could get a bit tough. If we're going with the three different scales/categories we should keep it at that, and not further break down each category into further semi categories eg ready made, full custom.
blurx7 had some good points about the scoring system. Maybe we could add restrictions to diorama size, say no bigger than 15metres (49 feet) relative to scale. So a dio at 1/32 should be no bigger than 1.5 feet and a 1/18 dio should therefore be no larger than 2.7 feet sq.
In terms of grading people who are entering the same comp but have different skill levels. What if people who are more comfortable with customising are scored against a higher points system. So if someone only uses ready made models and poses them in a scene they are rated against 10, were as someone who has completely scratch built a vehicle is rated against 20. The final scores are then worked out as a percentage - the one with the highest wins. Or maybe customisers are graded against additional criteria. So if people want to scratch build a gun implacement they will be subject to points in terms of build quality were someone using ready made models aren't.

Col.Pickle · Post by **Col.Pickle** » Sun Jul 08, 2007 10:17 am

woah so many ideas! Okay I think that it is decided that there customization IS allowed. Does everyone agreee with me on this point? Also by photoshopping would u say editing out a string holding up a plane be considered illegal? In my opinion we should just say no to photo editing just too simplify things and make it more fair. And lastly I say we leave theme picking to judges. As of now who do we have for judges again? Lightning maybe and blurx7 possible. But we still need one more. Man I wish I could judge and participate.

Can't have everything.

Small Scale Military Headquarters

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