For those interested..The Story behind HM's 234/2

Your forum dedicated to 1/32nd and smaller plastic and metal figures and vehicles.
Post Reply
Panzer_M
Officer - Brigadier General
Officer - Brigadier General
Posts: 4129
Joined: Wed Jul 26, 2006 12:23 am
Location: Port St. Johns

For those interested..The Story behind HM's 234/2

Post by Panzer_M » Fri Jul 23, 2010 5:17 am

Tactical numbering of 1./PzAA2.

http://www.network54.com/Forum/571595/t ... %3B+etc%29
Some years ago Hans Weber was able to ‘crack the code’, so to speak, of how 1. Kompanie, Panzer-Aufklärungs-Abteilung 2. numbered their Panzerspähwagen (PSW). The sequence is believed to have included these numbers:

“111”, “112”
“121”, “122”
“131”, “132”
“141”, “142”
“151”, “152”
“161”, “162”
“171”, “172”
“181”, “182”
“191”, “192”
“1101”, “1102”
“1111”, “1112”
“1121”, “1122”
“1131”, “1132”
“1141”, “1142”
“1151”, “1152”

[NB: given the ongoing debate over numbers and types of actual vehicles in the Kompanie and the common instance of having distinctly numbered commander and deputy commander's vehicles in a given Kompanien, there may be the possibility "101" and "102" also existed in 1./PzAA2]

Essentially, instead of following the official guidelines many other units appeared to adopt, where the unit was split into a relatively low number of Zuge (ie platoons) with several vehicles in each Zuge; instead 1./PzAA2 split their unit into several Truppen (ie troops), with only two vehicles in each Truppe.

The actual make up of the Kompanie as far as PSW types go is yet to be agreed upon, but it is clear the majority of vehicles were Sdkfz 234/2 (ie in modern parlance “Pumas”), probably 25 to begin with; plus originally perhaps up to six SdKfz 233 in the last three Truppen (ie 13-15). Note: there is some debate as to the presence of perhaps at least one SdKfz 222 and a handful of SdKfz 231/232 mixed in with the “Pumas” in Normandie, plus perhaps at a later stage SdKfz 234/1 and 234/3, but photos of any of these types are yet to be verified.

The growing number of photos available have also now revealed another aspect of the numbering system adopted by 1./PzAA2, which involved the additional application of Truppe numbers on the vehicles lower sides, along these lines:

“111” - White “1” on fwd bin doors, “112”- Black “1” on fwd bin doors
“121” - White “2” on fwd bin doors, “122”- Black “2” on fwd bin doors
“131” - White “3” on fwd bin doors, “132”- Black “3” on fwd bin doors
“141” - White “4” on fwd bin doors, “142”- Black “4” on fwd bin doors
“151” - White “5” on fwd bin doors, “152”- Black “5” on fwd bin doors
“161” - White “6” on fwd bin doors, “162”- Black “6” on fwd bin doors
“171” - White “7” on fwd bin doors, “172”- Black “7” on fwd bin doors
“181” - White “8” on fwd bin doors, “182”- Black “8” on fwd bin doors
“191” - White “9” on fwd bin doors, “192”- Black “9” on fwd bin doors
“1101” - White “10” on fwd bin doors, “1102”- Black “10” on fwd bin doors
“1111” - White “11” on fwd bin doors, “1112”- Black “11” on fwd bin doors
“1121” - White “12” on fwd bin doors, “1122”- Black “12” on fwd bin doors
“1131” - White “13” on fwd bin doors, “1132”- Black “13” on fwd bin doors
“1141” - White “14” on fwd bin doors, “1142”- Black “14” on fwd bin doors
“1151” - White “15” on fwd bin doors, “1152”- Black “15” on fwd bin doors

[NB: In the case of "1111" and "111" the Truppe number was repeated on the LHS of the rear plate, but its not clear if this was a completely uniform feature on 1./PzAA2 PSW at this stage, as both "181" and the "1152" would appear not to have LH rear numbers. Better photos would be needed to verify these cases. Also, it can only assumed at this stage the white and black Truppe numbers appeared on the sides of non-SdKfz 234/2 types, like the SdKfz 233, as photos are yet to confirm this]
Image

^ Now where have I seen that one before. :wink:

Image
good traders/sellers/buyers
Alloyskull(x2), PanzerArm(x2), Ostketten, Mikeg,tmanthegreat,Coreyeagle48

NHoggard12
Officer - 2nd Lieutenant
Officer - 2nd Lieutenant
Posts: 420
Joined: Thu Jan 17, 2008 6:52 pm
Location: Greensboro, NC

Post by NHoggard12 » Sat Jul 24, 2010 7:18 pm

Great information---thanks
great photos of a cool vehicle

Panzer_M
Officer - Brigadier General
Officer - Brigadier General
Posts: 4129
Joined: Wed Jul 26, 2006 12:23 am
Location: Port St. Johns

Post by Panzer_M » Sat Jul 24, 2010 7:52 pm

Going thru the Bundesachives with some collegues, We've yet to find any info on 234/3 with 2.Pz(Or Pz Lehr)

Did find Pz Lehr and 2.Pz were issued 234/1 before Wacht am Rhein.

And it's interested to note, 2.Pz Still had 233(7.5cmL24 Panzerspähwagen based on the 231/232 8rad) in Dec/Jan.44 2.Pz AA lost one of them in the fighting around the town of Foy as captured in a photo taken at the time.
good traders/sellers/buyers
Alloyskull(x2), PanzerArm(x2), Ostketten, Mikeg,tmanthegreat,Coreyeagle48

NHoggard12
Officer - 2nd Lieutenant
Officer - 2nd Lieutenant
Posts: 420
Joined: Thu Jan 17, 2008 6:52 pm
Location: Greensboro, NC

Post by NHoggard12 » Sun Jul 25, 2010 6:55 am

any info on the 243/3 coming out in august?

Panzer_M
Officer - Brigadier General
Officer - Brigadier General
Posts: 4129
Joined: Wed Jul 26, 2006 12:23 am
Location: Port St. Johns

Post by Panzer_M » Sun Jul 25, 2010 9:25 am

already in stock and selling at one of my HK dealers I buy models from.
good traders/sellers/buyers
Alloyskull(x2), PanzerArm(x2), Ostketten, Mikeg,tmanthegreat,Coreyeagle48

Panzer_M
Officer - Brigadier General
Officer - Brigadier General
Posts: 4129
Joined: Wed Jul 26, 2006 12:23 am
Location: Port St. Johns

Post by Panzer_M » Sun Jul 25, 2010 2:04 pm

he's sold 6 so far today on his ebay store.

I'm debating on ordering one from him, but by the time it would get here, 7-14days(7$ shipping) I bet US vendors will have them.
good traders/sellers/buyers
Alloyskull(x2), PanzerArm(x2), Ostketten, Mikeg,tmanthegreat,Coreyeagle48

Post Reply