21C existing mold modifications could equal...

[olifant]

I have been hoping for a T-34 in 1/32 from 21C for some time, but as much as I would love to see them I doubt it will be anytime soon.

With the release of the Firefly it got me thinking about the other models they could do with parts from their existing molds. Here is what I could think of:

Sherman variants

- Sherman Calliope: This would be very simple and would not cost much more than the dozer unit to produce. I love this and have made one myself out of straws and wood. I am not much of a scratch-built modeler so I would love to have one produced by the major manufacturers.

- M10 Tank Destroyer: Only the running gear and tracks could be used but I would love to see more US armor. After six or seven M-4 versions I start getting bored.

- SP 155MM M-whatever it is. Sorry, I am too lazy to get up and dig out the books to determine the designation number. Once again only the running gear and track could be used, but we already have the 155MM cannon to use.

- M-4 with the 105MM instead of the 75MM. This is not a huge change but I would pick a few up.

M-5 Stuart

- The 75MM model would be awfully nice with only a new turret.

M-24 Chafee

- A 40MM Duster model isn't really WWII but would be a nice add for Korea. This would look great in my opinion.

- A 105MM SP version. I don't think this is necessary as not too many were produced. I would rather see other releases done before this.

M-3 Halftrack

- A 105MM SP version would be very nice and could be done with little modification. This would be a great model to go against the DAK MKIIIs.

PZIII chassis

- StugIII. I know FOV has one out but I think the market could support another. I would sure like to see a Stug-42 model to support the troops. Only the running gear and tracks would work but one chassis could do both variants.

PZIV chassis

Can you say SP?
- Nashorn. Once again we have the running gear and tracks, but also have the 88MM gun. Only the chassis need be done.

- A Hummel could be done with the running gear and tracks.

- A Wespe could be done with the running gear and tracks.

- I think a Jadgpanzer IV would be wonderful. Once again only the running gear and tracks could be used.

Sdkfz 251

There is a lot of potential here:

- 75MM Pak version would be awfully cool. We have the chassis and gun available.

- 81MM mortar carrier version; once again we have the chassis and gun.

- Stuka Zu Fuss version. The rockets and crates could be done easily.

Anything I have missed? Weigh in and tell us what you would like to see most.

TKO, help us out and let 21C know we need more armor! They can even do it on the cheap! Build it and we will buy.

[ostketten]

I have been hoping for a T-34 in 1/32 from 21C for some time, but as much as I would love to see them I doubt it will be anytime soon.

Sadly, I think you are correct in your assessment. I doubt 21C will produce any Soviet armor soon, if ever, but if they ever did I would like to see a JS-II and/or an SU-100, then an SU-152 and/or a KV-1 or KV-2 could be made from the JS chassis.

[blurx7]

21C has a way of surprising us. They did put out the Russian soldiers. I am going to bet they had a reason. They did bring out Italian soldiers to support the Macchi. Maybe we will get Soviet armor to support the infantry.
Or how about a Yak?

[ostketten]

Or how about a Yak?

Sorry, but I have no interest in a Tibetan pack mule....LOLLLL!!
But seriously Geoff, I hope you're right.

One thing about the Yak, they do come in a variety of "paint schemes", here's an S2 winter version, LOLLL!!

[Panzer_M]

M-5 Stuart

- The 105MM model would be awfully nice with only a new turret.


no..the M8 HMC was a 75mm SPG.

and the Wespe was based on the Pz. II chassis not the Pz. IV.

[rose4472g]

.

- A Wespe could be done with the running gear and tracks.

The Wespe was done on a PZKW II chassis?


David

[olifant]

You got me PanzerM on the support gun Stuart. It was late night thoughts and I was not going to double check each variant for model numbers.

I just learned something new about the Wespe; I thought for sure you were wrong so I looked this up and darned if you aren't correct. I had no idea the PZII was used for this, or the Marder chassis. I thought all the Marders were done on the 38T chassis.

Thank you for the heads up!

[Rowsdower]

Hummel Hummel Hummel!!!!!!!

[Panzer_M]

also the Nashorn used parts of the Pz IV and Pz. III in it's running gear to be correct.

8.8cm PaK43 (L/71) auf Geschützwagen III/IV or Sd. Kfz. 164

The III/IV mean the use of the two Marks of panzer for the chassis

actual breakdown of sharing was Panzer III (driving and steering system) and Panzer IV chassis (suspension and engine).

Also the Hummel used the same chassis and upper glacis plates as the Nashorn. Just different Mount, Gun and internal Store for Muntions etc.

[Panzer_M]

Also the Hummel changed it's front plate in Late production, which may not have effected Nashorns which were already out of production at the time...but I am not sure on the date of the change, it was redesigned to give more room to the front compartment for the driver and radio operator.

[Wieslaw]

I wanted rather the Sherman variants. I don't suppose this second most produced tank of the war will be enough attractive for FoV and 21CT to make new molds of the hull. So, we will stay with the M4 (21CT - well, there are two ones, with a sharp or three-parts round nose) and M4A3 (FoV) for ever . But even with these two hulls they have got a lot of possibilities, too. For example, if the 21CT changed the differential and final drive housing in their Firefly to the sharp one and change the form of the radio box - there should be the proper Mk Ic Firefly, maybe, with very attractive Polish 2nd Armoured Brigade markings .

[krieglok]

Dont forget the M4 high speed tractors to pull the large artillery pieces they put out. That would be based off the Stuart chassis. It would be nice if they considered "companion" pieces to what they have made already. More soft skin stuff would be nice, like an ambulance, 3/4 or 1 1/2 ton Dodges or jeeps, kubelwagens- mostly stuff they made in 1:18. I find it odd they never did a 1:32 AA halftrack with the quad .50s. I guess they have tons of ideas, but they can only do so much.

I have a M10 tank destroyer model I started, calling to me from my model closet. I will pull it out and finish it just as 21st comes out with one...

TJ

[luftpanzer]

You guys scare me!!

[olifant]

Luftpanzer, there is nothing to fear but fear itself.




And collecting driven divorce!

[krieglok]

What? The "talking closet" thing?

TJ

[jrs.]

I think that you couldnt be more off! 21st is likely to not do any of the above because it makes sense.

The firefly came out in 2007, the M4 in 2002?? Five years to do a turett?

They just created a maurader and thats a lot of detail, new chassi superstructure etc.... an M10 or m4105 would have been too easy!


The 251??? Please a Grief??? A com bench with a few radios and a antena rack... will never see it. Pioneer version 251-7 another easy one! You could go on and on, at the very least we should get the 1:18 versions? The 22 and the Fuss! M3 how about the M16??


i think you will see something odd and one off for 21st. If history tells us anything I bet we should see something that fails to fit in anywhere, perhaps a middle east renault light tank??? Or a romanian armored car??? M113 anyone????

I do agree that duster model sounds pretty cool WW2 or not.

[grunt1]

The 113 was a pretty good choice given that 21C was doing Vietnam, Gulf War / Modern and what-not during that time period.

That being said.. you're right.. The next vehicle will likely be the Vespe-zooka! Bizarre and cheap to make!

License the mold from Maisto, slap the recoilless from the Humvee on it and out the door she goes.. Probably get about six re-paints..

Factory fresh green, field drab, field drab with mud, french foreign legion edition, rusty junkyard version and modern restored museum edition..

[Panzer_M]

I think that you couldnt be more off! 21st is likely to not do any of the above because it makes sense.

The firefly came out in 2007, the M4 in 2002?? Five years to do a turett?

They just created a maurader and thats a lot of detail, new chassi superstructure etc.... an M10 or m4105 would have been too easy!


The 251??? Please a Grief??? A com bench with a few radios and a antena rack... will never see it. Pioneer version 251-7 another easy one! You could go on and on, at the very least we should get the 1:18 versions? The 22 and the Fuss! M3 how about the M16??


i think you will see something odd and one off for 21st. If history tells us anything I bet we should see something that fails to fit in anywhere, perhaps a middle east renault light tank??? Or a romanian armored car??? M113 anyone????

I do agree that duster model sounds pretty cool WW2 or not.

Greif was a Sdkfz.250/3 alte

The 251 version is the 251/6

[Col.Pickle]

The 113 was a pretty good choice given that 21C was doing Vietnam, Gulf War / Modern and what-not during that time period.

That being said.. you're right.. The next vehicle will likely be the Vespe-zooka! Bizarre and cheap to make!

License the mold from Maisto, slap the recoilless from the Humvee on it and out the door she goes.. Probably get about six re-paints..

Factory fresh green, field drab, field drab with mud, french foreign legion edition, rusty junkyard version and modern restored museum edition..

LOL. The variant of a sherman I'd like to see most would be te calliope. Reminds me of those wheely-rocket thingies from star wars

[binder001]

[quote="olifantWith the release of the Firefly it got me thinking about the other models they could do with parts from their existing molds. Here is what I could think of:

Sherman variants

- Sherman Calliope: This would be very simple and would not cost much more than the dozer unit to produce. I love this and have made one myself out of straws and wood. I am not much of a scratch-built modeler so I would love to have one produced by the major manufacturers.

*** Calliope (4.5 inch Rocket Launcher T34) - a nice one was made in 1/32nd by Monogram back in the mid 1970s. They still show up on eBay. The launcher could be transplanted onto the Sherman quite easily (I have done it). The M4A1 hull from the "Screamin Mimi could be used (with major surgery) to replace the HORRIBLE hull on the 21C M4s. 21C made the driver's hatches too big (to allow figures to be placed) but that screws up the proportions of the whole front hull.

- M10 Tank Destroyer: Only the running gear and tracks could be used but I would love to see more US armor. After six or seven M-4 versions I start getting bored

*** Agreed - we are WAY overdue for an M10!.

- SP 155MM M-whatever it is. Sorry, I am too lazy to get up and dig out the books to determine the designation number. Once again only the running gear and track could be used, but we already have the 155MM cannon to use.

*** No we don't. The 155 used in the M12 was an older French design from WW1 - not the Long Tom. The M12 was originally based on the M3 Lee. When 74 were rebuilt for use in Europe they used M4 components, so the M12 is kind of a bastard child of the M3 and M4. The Long Tom was placed in a very modified M4 chassis and became the M40. Very few M40s saw action in WW2.

- M-4 with the 105MM instead of the 75MM. This is not a huge change but I would pick a few up.

*** BIG problem - the M4 (105mm) used an entirely different upper hull from the 21C. The 105 howitzer versions of both the M4 and M4A3 used the later hull with 47 degree hull front (no protruding divers' hoods). The turret would need to be like the FoV turret - with loader's escape hatch ( and a second ventilator on the rear top). These were very common after mid-1944 serving in Bn HQ Assault Gun Platoons.

M-5 Stuart

- The 75MM model would be awfully nice with only a new turret.

*** you are thinking of the M8 75mm Howitzer Motor Carriage - new upper hull and new turret (and PROPER tracks would be nice)

M-24 Chafee

- A 40MM Duster model isn't really WWII but would be a nice add for Korea. This would look great in my opinion.

*** THe twin 40mm version of the M24 was the M19 - the turret was mounted way back on the hull. The M42 Duster was on the M41 light tank chassis (also produced by 21C)

- A 105MM SP version. I don't think this is necessary as not too many were produced. I would rather see other releases done before this.

*** M37 105mm Howitzer Motor Carriage. Too late to see action in WW2.

M-3 Halftrack

- A 105MM SP version would be very nice and could be done with little modification. This would be a great model to go against the DAK MKIIIs.

*** The 75mm Tank Destroyer version would be nice too, as well as the M15A1 AAA version with a 37mm and two .50s in a turret on the rear of a halftrack chassis.

[Wieslaw]

*** BIG problem - the M4 (105mm) used an entirely different upper hull from the 21C. The 105 howitzer versions of both the M4 and M4A3 used the later hull with 47 degree hull front (no protruding divers' hoods).

Binder, there were also the 105mm M4s with the older upper hull. Some of them used by the Polish 2nd Arm. Brigade/Division in Italy.

[olifant]

For Binder and everyone else:

Would you not buy a piece from 21C because of historical innacuracies? It wouldn't bother me one bit. If I want to be a detail Nazi I would move to 1/35 and build my own.

[binder001]

1) Howitzer Shermans - They were ALL on the newer 47 degree hull front - except for one prototype vehicle. No matter who used them or where, they all left the factory with late production features. I have several thousand Sherman photos and haven't ever seen any structural variation in the assault gun tanks.

2) Details - important to some (me, for instance) and not to others. It's a free country. I DO resent it when a company doesn't do basic homework and just slavisly copies another company's errors (the 21C M5A1 is a direct scale-up of the Tamiya model kit - complete with ALL the errors, right down to the last goof). Some things I can rebuild, others I can't. I wish I could get several suspensions from the FoV M4A3 to correct the 21C Shermans, as well as a batch of the aircleaners that were on the rear plate of the original production 21C Shermans.

Gary

[grunt1]

For Binder and everyone else:

Would you not buy a piece from 21C because of historical innacuracies? It wouldn't bother me one bit. If I want to be a detail Nazi I would move to 1/35 and build my own.

Roger that!

[Wieslaw]

1) Howitzer Shermans - They were ALL on the newer 47 degree hull front - except for one prototype vehicle. No matter who used them or where, they all left the factory with late production features. I have several thousand Sherman photos and haven't ever seen any structural variation in the assault gun tanks.
Gary

Gary,
I want to apologize. You are absolutely right. I checked up the books and photos I have once again and, yes, the hull of ALL 105mm Shermans is new... In the Polish Shermans Mk. Ib, of course too. It is a perfect lesson for me: I should better verify all I write here. Sorry, Gary and All!
Wieslaw