21c Retooled P-51 Reviews??

tmanthegreat · Post by **tmanthegreat** » Mon Mar 06, 2006 9:57 pm

There's a number of you boardmembers that have seen the 1:18 version of this plane in the eastern US now. For those of you who purchased and assembled one, how does it rate with other 21c aircraft, and most importantly, how does it compare to the BBi P-51?

I'm thinking about preordering a 21c P-51 from an online retailer, but looking at the Area21 pictures, do not see any major difference between it and the BBI version (save for some small details) and naturaully, I want to save my money for more origional future aircraft releases if this one is not all that spetacular...

Lefty · Post by **Lefty** » Thu Mar 09, 2006 9:30 pm

Just got my shipping notification from BadCat that my Flying Undertaker is on its way - will post a review once it gets here - can't wait!!! The paint job looks great and I'm glad they finally released this scheme.

I also have BBI's Killer, Cripes-A-Mighty, and Hurry Home Honey and will compare them to the new and the old 21C P-51s if you want.

tmanthegreat · Post by **tmanthegreat** » Thu Mar 09, 2006 10:54 pm

I ordered "The Flying Undertaker" as well, but from another small retailer with a preorder price well below BCA in this instance. My plane will come a little later, but I'm not worried. Another member left a review of the "Ridge Runner" version (found at Wal Marts in the eastern US) in one of the 21c finds and discussons threads and it sounds like this plane is very similar to the BBI version, only that much more accurate in look to a real Mustang. The wing hardpoints and landing gear, at least, are correct on the new 21c version! Still, when you get your plane, do post a review.

Lefty · Post by **Lefty** » Wed Mar 15, 2006 4:44 pm

Got my Undertaker today!

Looks great - the short version of my review is:
-I love the paint scheme and overall fit/finish
-I compared it to my 21C Lou IV - surprisingly, the Lou IV can still hold its own IMO, but the Undertaker looks more like a model and less like a toy compared to the Lou IV
-Compared to the BBI Mustangs I have (Killer, Cripes-A-Mighty, Hurry Home Honey) it lacks the detail of the rivets and wheels (EDIT: the wheels are fine, what I should have said was the tire tread is more detailed on the BBI - I have no idea if this is more realistic or not), and the fuel tanks aren't quite as detailed (EDIT: doesn't matter to me as I prefer the bombs anyway!), but the Undertaker is still a sweet plane - I am undecided about the rivets, on the one hand they are very cool/realistic but on the other hand on a smaller scale they can look a little too "busy" on the wings and the cleaner look of the Undertaker is appealing to me
-The pilot is pretty bland looking IMO - mine looks sort of like a wall-eyed Bill Murray (circa Ghostbusters era) but it moves good and fit in the plane fine (and the scale is better than the early 21C Mustangs)
-The covers for the holes where the screws go in is a good idea, but I had a heck of a time getting the one in back (by the air intake scoop) to go in correctly - the only plane I've spent more time on assembling was the BBI Zero (getting the cockpit in correctly and FINALLY getting the rear landing gear to lock in place)

Hope everybody who ordered one gets them soon and they look as good as mine!

scbvideoboy · Post by **scbvideoboy** » Wed Mar 15, 2006 5:41 pm

Did I miss a memo? Your actually susposed to take them out of the box?

And then what?

DH

MightyMustang · Post by **MightyMustang** » Fri Mar 17, 2006 10:47 am

Hey Lefty,

Thanks for the review on the new tool 21st Mustang and how it compares to the BBI Mustang. After reading your review I'm gonna pass on the 21st Mustang and stick with BBI. There dont seem to be that much difference between the 2 except for a few things here and there like the forward "rake" deal which aint no biggie to me. As for rivets? I think that BBI's version of the P-51D looks more realistic then the 21st version. It dont have that "toy" look to it. "Old Crow" will be on its way soon as well from BBI so thats another reason I'm gonna pass.

So now I look forward to the 21st Avenger which from what I heard will be apon us soon and god knows how big that will be!!! Now if only 21st would have painted it up wearing Bunker Hill colors, it would be a great teamate for my Bunker Hill Hedrick Corsair.

tko211 · Post by **tko211** » Fri Mar 17, 2006 11:38 am

I received my Undertaker yesterday. What a great aircraft! First off, I really like this scheme I think it is one of the more striking profiles with the bold black stripes and yellow accents.

One thing that was a welcomed item were the 2 bombs that can be placed on the hard points under the wings. If the bombs aren't your flavor the drop tanks can be used instead. Also 21st has the Drop tanks in the correct postion.

IMHO I think the cleaner wing is hands down more realistic than the "bomber rivets" of prior releases. The P-51D's I have been close to in real life have smooth wing surfaces.

The main gear are by far better, and the tail gear looks spot on. This model looks great on its gear or in flight.

The moving surfaces in my opinion are superior to anything else on the market. With huge degree of travel, plus fixable positions without the use of inferior pull tab devices make this pony the best in my book.

The shape of the nose is also the most accurate. Although it takes a Mustang expert to REALLY see it. The spinner, and chin scoop just look perfect to me!

I can't wait to see Petie 2nd! That is the next one I really want.

Lefty · Post by **Lefty** » Fri Mar 17, 2006 3:33 pm

I have a ritual that me and my daughters do every time I get a new plane where they wait patiently for me to get it put together, and then we zoom around the living room a couple of times making loud airplane noises - it's our own little way of buzzing the tower (the tower in this case being their Mother, who stands with arms crossed in disbelief as she wonders where I'm gonna find room for yet ANOTHER plane!

)

scbvideoboy wrote:Did I miss a memo? Your actually susposed to take them out of the box?

And then what?

DH

Lefty · Post by **Lefty** » Fri Mar 17, 2006 3:37 pm

Certainly your call - but I think you're making a mistake if you don't get at least 1 of the new 21C paint schemes - they look great!

I'm certainly not a P-51 (or aircraft in general) expert by any means (thanks for the specifics, TKO!) - but I do know what I like and the Flying Undertaker is awesome. I've been a sucker for P-51's since I was a kid!

MightyMustang wrote:Hey Lefty,

Thanks for the review on the new tool 21st Mustang and how it compares to the BBI Mustang. After reading your review I'm gonna pass on the 21st Mustang and stick with BBI. There dont seem to be that much difference between the 2 except for a few things here and there like the forward "rake" deal which aint no biggie to me. As for rivets? I think that BBI's version of the P-51D looks more realistic then the 21st version. It dont have that "toy" look to it. "Old Crow" will be on its way soon as well from BBI so thats another reason I'm gonna pass.

So now I look forward to the 21st Avenger which from what I heard will be apon us soon and god knows how big that will be!!! Now if only 21st would have painted it up wearing Bunker Hill colors, it would be a great teamate for my Bunker Hill Hedrick Corsair.

Sabrefan · Post by **Sabrefan** » Fri Mar 17, 2006 4:00 pm

I am a big P-51 fan myself. I have The Flying Undertaker coming in nest week. I am so glad they got the landing gear right. The Mustang is one airplane that looks as good on the ground as it does in the air.

Jericoeagle1 · Post by **Jericoeagle1** » Sat Mar 18, 2006 11:40 am

Overall I'm pleased with the new P-51 but I recieved one that has the same problem that seems to plague every 21st airplane I get the propeller blades arn't straight. They are all bent to the rear slightly. It destroys the astetics of the model. Normally I can fix the problem but the plades are too close to the hub to try without damaging the model. I hope they can address that in the future.

Post by **aferguson** » Sat Mar 18, 2006 2:01 pm

Lefty wrote:I have a ritual that me and my daughters do every time I get a new plane where they wait patiently for me to get it put together, and then we zoom around the living room a couple of times making loud airplane noises - it's our own little way of buzzing the tower (the tower in this case being their Mother, who stands with arms crossed in disbelief as she wonders where I'm gonna find room for yet ANOTHER plane! )

mikeg · Post by **mikeg** » Sat Mar 18, 2006 6:17 pm

I dont know if they are all bent to the rear, but it definately looks like the prop on my Ridge Runner had been involved in a belly landing. I think I know the answer to this question, but I'll ask it in public anyway. DId any of the p-51 variations have a curved prop like this or did 21st just run out of props left over off the Big Beautifull Doll ac??? I've seen curved props on some c-130s here at Lockeed but I believe that to be a far more current advance that that seen on a P-51. Therefore, if this is ridiculous error, perhaps a couple of yen a day to be the quality inspector is not sufficient to the task. (yeah, I know it is only a toy)'

DocTodd · Post by **DocTodd** » Sat Mar 18, 2006 10:54 pm

I was wondering about the rearword rake of the prop also. I thought perhaps this was some special modification in later model Mustangs that increased performance-or possibly just a slight inaccurracy in the model. I agree with Zach, the smoothness on the moving surfaces is impressive. I bought the Ridge runner thinking I would check it out and likely return it as I have several Mustangs already but this one looks like a keeper-perhaps I'm just a sucker for moving flight control surfaces.
Todd

Jericoeagle1 · Post by **Jericoeagle1** » Sun Mar 19, 2006 2:33 am

DocTodd wrote:I was wondering about the rearword rake of the prop also. I thought perhaps this was some special modification in later model Mustangs that increased performance-or possibly just a slight inaccurracy in the model. I agree with Zach, the smoothness on the moving surfaces is impressive. I bought the Ridge runner thinking I would check it out and likely return it as I have several Mustangs already but this one looks like a keeper-perhaps I'm just a sucker for moving flight control surfaces.
Todd

Its not a mod, its poor assembly. There was never any rake to the mustang prop. Over a third of the planes I got from 21st have this problem. I usually solve this by using a razor saw and carefully going about half way through the base of the prop where the hub is. I then pull it forward until it begins to break, by this time its just about straight I then fill the sawed gap with gap filling super glue. the prop is then straight and as strong as ever. Unfortunately, on the flying undertaker I can't get access to the hub because of the spinner.

USCGSARdog · Post by **USCGSARdog** » Sun Mar 19, 2006 6:10 am

Mikeg- those C-130's you saw with the curved prop blades are likley J model Hercs or better. They have 6-blade composite props that look pretty wild!

Jericoeagle1- I too have repaired a few 21C props using that method; it works great. The proplem with the new Mustang is that like you said, you can't get to the base of the blade. And to me, it looks like the blade itself has an awful bow in it, not just the base. I'm thinking that in order to remove the bow from each blade you may have to heat the plastic and bend it until its flat. What are your thoughts?

-Rob

Post by **aferguson** » Sun Mar 19, 2006 6:41 am

i was going to suggest taking a blow dryer to the blades. You may find with some heating that they straighten out on their own. Sometimes things get packaged while still warm and that warps them. Reheating (like with a blow dryer) will cause them to go back to their original shape.

Worth a try anyway...the plastic used on these models is pretty tough so it shouldn't be damaged by trying.

DocTodd · Post by **DocTodd** » Mon Mar 20, 2006 8:25 pm

I will give the dryer a try and see how it goes.
Thanks,
Todd

JohnLumley · Post by **JohnLumley** » Tue Mar 21, 2006 7:52 am

Interesting observation…

While looking over the instruction sheet that came with “Ridge Runner” & “Flying Undertaker” I noticed the propeller in the photos is not the same as what comes on the model. (Notice the cross section of the propeller blade as it enters the spinner)

Also note that the aircraft pictured in the instructions is the “Petie 2nd”. Usually the series one release is pictured in the instruction sheet.

MightyMustang · Post by **MightyMustang** » Tue Mar 21, 2006 12:44 pm

My freind got the new tool Mustang "The Flying Undertaker" yesturday and so we made some comparisions between the BBI version and the 21st version. So here is my review.

First thing was that the new tool Mustang has bent prop blades that many of you guys have pointed out. But it does have the correct spinner unlike the BBI version which aint all that noticable unless your a die hard Mustang fan like myself. But it aint that bad in my view. The 21st Mustang has the options of metal drop tanks and bombs. The metal tanks dont have the pluming like BBI but for some that aint no biggie. Cockpit? BBI wins hands down in my opinion although 21st did a good job.

Landing gear. Looks good with the forward rake but the tires on the 21st Mustang look to thin and compared to the BBI version they are.

Overall opinion. I have to say that 21st has come out with a good representation of the P-51D BUT is it better then BBI? Yes and no. From the comparisions of my freinds Mustang and mine I would have to say they are even. His looks pretty and polished and mine looks like a battle worn warrior thats fought hard in the skies over Europe. Maybe thats because I made mine look that way I dont know. For me buying the new tool Mustang is a must because I have to support 21st because they are a great company. I'll pass on Ridge Runner and buy Petie The 2nd when I find it but more then likely I'll buy it online. But if your asking me who made the better P-51 I'll say its even between the two and neither one is a clear cut winner over the other. They both have their good and bad points. The bent prop blades worry me though I will say that.

Otherwise you cant lose either way.

PS: I forgot to mention that the rudders on the 21st Mustang ARE better then BBI's so I'll give them that. Those are an improvement.

Sabrefan · Post by **Sabrefan** » Tue Mar 21, 2006 1:04 pm

When I got my original release of the 21st Century Corsair all three prop blades were bent forward. I don't what the deal is with these props, but it really does take away from the look of the model.

Sabrefan · Post by **Sabrefan** » Fri Mar 24, 2006 9:33 pm

I got my 21st Century P-51 "The Flying Undertaker" today. Great looking model, and I like what they did with the landing gear. One big problem is the darn prop. As you guys said the blades are bent backwards. I was able to pull the whole prop off the plane, this assembly comes with the chin scoop. It was hard to get out, but the bottom of the fuse openned up enough to get it out. The spinner is two pieces held together buy a screw that also hold the prop assembly to plane. With the front part of the spinner off, I cut all four blades off. I then glued the front and back of the spinner together, filled the crack, then sanded it smoot so there is no gap. Then I drilled holes in the bottom of each prop blade, and holes in the spinner where the blades will attach. I then glued metal rods into each of the blades. I repainted the spinner yellow and silver, then glued the blade rods into the spinner. It looks great, I will try to get a digital camera and let you guys see how much better the P-51 looks with the blades not bending back.

CW4USARMY · Post by **CW4USARMY** » Sat Mar 25, 2006 11:19 am

Finally found the 1:18 Ridgerunner today and after looking at it, I wanted to leave it on the shelf, but being the completist that I am, I went ahead and bought it. There were four of them and all of them had the bent props and only one had a decent enough paint job without smudges and the like.
On one of them, you could actually see where someone at the factory actually used a paint brush and silver paint to cover over what must have been a pretty bad mistake. Its a shame that the props are bent on all of them, even the Undertaker version (which I have preordered from a member here). Think we'lll see 21st posting an apology for the props or an offer to replace them? Ha! LOL!!

You'd think they would have caught this snafu and fixed it, but what the hey, we'll all buy them anyway and they know it.

I guess the business model is, the bigger you get, the less you pay attention to customer service....if this is the case, I hope Admiral doesnt get too big.

(Just kidding Jason, hope you guys take the lead!)

JOC · Post by **JOC** » Sat Mar 25, 2006 11:40 am

Glad I waited on this one.

Looks like I will stick with BBI Mustangs until 21st "gets their act together" and decides to fix this bent prop model. Maybe if everyone sent theirs back for a repair, replacement, forget that idea.............
I wonder if BBI's prop would fit?
JOC

tmanthegreat · Post by **tmanthegreat** » Sat Mar 25, 2006 1:16 pm

It is kind of funny as it seems that the BBI Mustang and 21c retooled version pretty much compliment eachother, with none being the real contender over the other. The BBI one has the misplaced hardpoints, unraked gear, and the wrong tail wheel, while the 21c Mustang has the bent props and no weathering or riveting.

I've got "The Flying Undertaker" on preorder from a boardmember, where I got it for a good price. Although the 21c bird only seems to offer minor improvements over the BBI version that I already have, the plane does have a cool paint scheme, and given that the Mustang is my favorite WWII plane, and I have multiples on others like the Corsair, ME-109 and FW-190, why not get another Mustang to even the score