Admiral's new F-86 Sabre

[dragon53]

I got this from Jason's February post on another message board...my apologies if it's a repeat:


I never thought I would have to say NSFW (Not Safe For Work) on a thread pertaining to a model aircraft. But this is one of those days. Furthermore, I am sure nudity would be strictly forbidden in any other circumstance. But I am taking a chance and introducing this great model to this forum. I do not remember if I post this information on any other forums. But here we go:

It is no secret to the collectors in this hobby that repaints are the bread and butter of the manufacturers. We do not realize a profit on the first release of a model. It is sad to say, but this industry has been put in a corner by pricing and that is not good for the manufacturers.

So Admiral Toys Incorporated would like to introduce you to a new repaint that we are working on and hope it raises some eyebrows and catches the attention of the collector.

This aircraft is called the “Temptation” and I am sure you can see why! Yes this one is for the mature collector. But we feel it is done in good taste and accurately reflects the mount of LT Donald McLean in 1952 Korea. Admiral Toys will not shy away from an aircraft because it depicts the true nose-art of the era.

This aircraft will be a true collector’s piece. First, it is rare to find this form of nose-art on an aircraft in this scale. Secondly, it will be produced in very limited numbers and sold by only a few discerning retailers. We do not think there will be enough to go around. The price will be comparable to other limited releases and it might just come with a surprise: Lady Temptation might just accompany the aircraft in the form of a 1:18 figure. She will be dressed, but posing in the same fashion as on the aircraft. She is designed to be displayed on the wing of the jet, or on a stand right under here painting.

We hope you enjoy the Temptation and would like to hear your input on this project.

Here she is ladies and gentlemen, Temptation:




Let us know what you think on this one. We are going out on a limb, but we think it will be a very successful model. Admiral Toys is not afraid to try something a little edgy. We know the majority of the collectors are adults. Why not give then the opportunity to purchase a grownup’s model.

Regards,
Jason

[aferguson]

pure filth..

[batmex1]

Eeeeeeeeeewwwwww.....boobies! Shameful.......yet intriguing.....

[tmanthegreat]

Some of our younger members like Flyboy FX, V2 Man, Catman, and VMF115, had better cover their eyes lest their innocence be ruined

[Dauntless]

I like it, I like it a lot!

Not only is the nose art sweet, but the color scheme with the yellow nose enhances it beyond that.
Then you get the letters-numbers yeah!

I want one severely!

Nice choice of schemes Jason.

I'm willing to put some butter on that bread.
How do you get the heads up on this?

[skypirate]

Temptation and triple 6 club! I'll have to check out the additional info.

[VMF115]

VMF115, had better cover their eyes lest their innocence be ruined

My innocence was ruined on prom night back in 1992. .....how ever I am reborn and I am saving myself fior the right women.....





Who am I kidding......I like boobies way to much!!!!!!!!!



This is one F-86 that I can't wait to get!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[MCalamari]

Will this delay the CL-13 Hartmann (or has it been released already)?

If I had to choose between the Temptation and the Hartmann, I'd prefer the Hartmann. I've been wanting that particular plane for some time.

I do like the concept shown, and would probably buy both. The German Luftwaffe CL-13 that is currently out is one of my favorite collectibles ... got two of them.

[HardenSteel]

I like it!

HD

[Sentinel]

I might be able to make some room for that one!

[ExC17load]

Let's not get too excited just yet! The Hartman CL-13 is still MIA, along with other proposed schemes. That email is great for stirring up interest, but seeing is believing. I personally would rather see more effort put into making the Admiral web site work, then teasing up with possible schemes. That's not even mentioning the A-1 project and the Dauntless.

Focus, its easy to talk about a version, but the facts are that there are a plethora of delays, along with the fact that Admiral hasnt introduced anything new in a while!

Nice to think about, but I wont even think about getting excited untill someone has it for sale. Too many of the "pre-orders" have fallen by the wayside.

[DropTank]

Great scheme planned on the "Temptation". The Hartman and "el Diablo" schemes planned for a Early 2008 release were great also, but what happened to them? It is a nice proposed A/C, but it is hard to get excited about any new releases anymore with all the past projects left undone by all the company's.

[VMF115]

ExC17load yup that is how I feel.....talk is cheap but results are what we want to see...even if they are small steps like updating their website.

[sarge]

I got this from Jason's February post on another message board...my apologies if it's a repeat:


I never thought I would have to say NSFW (Not Safe For Work) on a thread pertaining to a model aircraft. But this is one of those days. Furthermore, I am sure nudity would be strictly forbidden in any other circumstance. But I am taking a chance and introducing this great model to this forum. I do not remember if I post this information on any other forums. But here we go:

It is no secret to the collectors in this hobby that repaints are the bread and butter of the manufacturers. We do not realize a profit on the first release of a model. It is sad to say, but this industry has been put in a corner by pricing and that is not good for the manufacturers.

So Admiral Toys Incorporated would like to introduce you to a new repaint that we are working on and hope it raises some eyebrows and catches the attention of the collector.

This aircraft is called the “Temptation” and I am sure you can see why! Yes this one is for the mature collector. But we feel it is done in good taste and accurately reflects the mount of LT Donald McLean in 1952 Korea. Admiral Toys will not shy away from an aircraft because it depicts the true nose-art of the era.

This aircraft will be a true collector’s piece. First, it is rare to find this form of nose-art on an aircraft in this scale. Secondly, it will be produced in very limited numbers and sold by only a few discerning retailers. We do not think there will be enough to go around. The price will be comparable to other limited releases and it might just come with a surprise: Lady Temptation might just accompany the aircraft in the form of a 1:18 figure. She will be dressed, but posing in the same fashion as on the aircraft. She is designed to be displayed on the wing of the jet, or on a stand right under here painting.

We hope you enjoy the Temptation and would like to hear your input on this project.

Here she is ladies and gentlemen, Temptation:




Let us know what you think on this one. We are going out on a limb, but we think it will be a very successful model. Admiral Toys is not afraid to try something a little edgy. We know the majority of the collectors are adults. Why not give then the opportunity to purchase a grownup’s model.

Regards,
Jason

Yawn Ho-Hum

[Jason of Admiral Toys]

Focus, its easy to talk about a version, but the facts are that there are a plethora of delays, along with the fact that Admiral hasnt introduced anything new in a while!

Nice to think about, but I wont even think about getting excited untill someone has it for sale. Too many of the "pre-orders" have fallen by the wayside.

You hit on a reason why we talk about so many different schemes. We do this to gauge the interest in the paint scheme and to advertise to the wholesalers and retailers that this would be a good purchase. Admiral Toys is not really in the business of retailing. We are a manufacturer that needs wholesalers and retailers. Unfortunately both retailer and wholesaler interest in this scale has cooled off dramatically. Retailers that would purchase three to four hundred models are only interested in purchasing forty to fifty models. This is a huge reduction in sales and forbids the manufacturers from producing more models. Notice that the only sales you are talking about lately are the MD liquidation of 21st’s inventory. They purchased the models for pennies on the dollar. 21st is unable to come out with another production even with all the liquidated models sold to MD.

I personally have been on the phone with our larger retailers and wholesalers talking up the new paint schemes and promising them exclusives, low pricing, very limited production runs etc. and they all say “we don’t want another repaint. The collector doesn’t want another repaint.” I know what you are thinking…. “Give the retailers and wholesalers what they want, new aircraft, and they will purchase every one of them….” Unfortunately that is easier said than done. I have stated over and over again that the manufacturers make their money with the repaints. If no one is interested in purchasing repaints, there is no money coming into the company to keep production running strong. It would be flat out stupid for a manufacturer to continue to run in the red just to please the market. That is what happens to companies that are soon to become, or are now bankrupt. This form of production has obviously been bad for the community at large.

These models are under priced. We would need to double our prices in order for us to make enough of a profit on the first run of an average sized 1:18 aircraft to go straight into production of a new release. And even then, we would have to sell at least two or three repaints to continue production. We would raise the price for the distributors and retailers who in turn would relay the price increase onto you the customer. You have been spoiled by mass liquidation at the mass retailers and the liquidation of companies liquidating the last of their efforts. I know you are not willing to pay the prices needed to have new releases released at the rates desired on this site and others. Admiral Toys has offered a $5 dollar model promotion! That is way under the cost of production. We are losing money on this promotion and have received murk warm interest from the market. That is not a good sign for the release of anything new. If we cannot sell a model at a loss what in the world makes you think that we would start the production of a new model that will cost us hundreds of thousands of dollars out of our personal pockets? Not a single wholesaler or retailer, including Walmart and Toys “R” Us will sign a guaranteed purchase order or pay for the production up front. A guaranteed purchase order is a tool used for us to go to a bank or investor and borrow the money for the production of that purchase order. If we default on the loan the bank can go after the person who guaranteed the purchase order. They are in essence a surety on the PO. Of course I understand the reluctance of any retailer or wholesaler in signing a guaranteed purchase order. Unfortunately, banks and investors do not loan money without said instruments. Where is the money for production? Answer, the manufacturer is out of pocket the whole sum of production until the models are here in the US and even then, the wholesaler and retailers want net 30 terms. This is a huge burden for the manufacturer.

I have a lot to do right now so I will get back on my soap box another day.

Regards,
Jason

[Jason of Admiral Toys]

Yawn Ho-Hum

Unfortunately, this is the attitude that will put every 1:18 manufacturer out of business, or encourage the ones that produce 1:18 to move on to other things. I understand your disinterest; however, the retailers and wholesalers gauge their interest in a model from the collectors interest.

I have been upbeat for sometime now. I have tried to give you hope for the industry. But I have got to say the light is getting dimmer and dimmer.

Regards,
Jason

[Dauntless]

Maybe we should do a poll?

I try to stay on the upbeat. Sure we've been dissapointed with things not panning out sometimes, with 21st allegedly going under, and no previews from BBI whatsoever, but we need to keep a stiff upper lip here. There is progress that we have seen with our own eyes from Jason and Admiral.


This paint scheme kills! Again, I for one want one!

[norman888]

You probably have to do something like the Wargame industry has done; set a break-even goal of pre-orders and only then move to production (1000 preorders??). I realize this may be a bit more tricky and don't know lead times or how long it takes to get a model from design to a customer's hands.

Another repaint of a model made by 2 different companies will not make Admiral much profit...I can guarantee that.

[Jason of Admiral Toys]

You probably have to do something like the Wargame industry has done; set a break-even goal of pre-orders and only then move to production (1000 preorders??). I realize this may be a bit more tricky and don't know lead times or how long it takes to get a model from design to a customer's hands.

Another repaint of a model made by 2 different companies will not make Admiral much profit...I can guarantee that.

I think you missed the point norman888 please read this part of the last paragraph again:

Not a single wholesaler or retailer, including Walmart and Toys “R” Us will sign a guaranteed purchase order or pay for the production up front (in essence norman888 a "pre-order" is an unsecured purchase order, not secured. We receive those all the time.). A guaranteed purchase order is a tool used by us to go to a bank or investor and borrow the money for the production of that purchase order. If we default on the loan the bank can go after the person who guaranteed the purchase order. They are in essence a surety on the PO. Of course I understand the reluctance of any retailer or wholesaler in signing a guaranteed purchase order. Unfortunately, banks and investors do not loan money without said instruments. Where is the money for production? Answer, the manufacturer is out of pocket the whole sum of production until the models are here in the US and even then, the wholesaler and retailers want net 30 terms. This is a huge burden for the manufacturer.

Therefore, norman888, setting pre-order goals has always been a practice of our company, but does not help in the least bit with the cost of production. It is just a list of pissed off people when their models don't come out on time.

And I know that we will not make as much on a duplicate repaint... biting tongue.... Neither did 21st and look where they are today.

I obviously need to step away from my desk and have a cinco de mayo beer. I will be in a better mood later.

Regards,
Jason

[sarge]

Yawn Ho-Hum

Unfortunately, this is the attitude that will put every 1:18 manufacturer out of business, or encourage the ones that produce 1:18 to move on to other things. I understand your disinterest; however, the retailers and wholesalers gauge their interest in a model from the collectors interest.

I have been upbeat for sometime now. I have tried to give you hope for the industry. But I have got to say the light is getting dimmer and dimmer.

Regards,
Jason

Sorry Jason but what type of attitude do you expect? Still waiting for the Dauntless dive bomber and the Sky Raider. As you say the light is getting dimmer and dimmer. With the wholesalers and retailers being reluctant to order coupled with the economy as it is, things will never be the same. Maybe it's time to rethink your options.

No matter which way you go "GOOD LUCK". I enjoyed your airplanes.

[alf]

Hi Jason,

thank you for your time to help us to understand the state of 1:18 war machine industry today.

Hope the skyraider and dauntless project will succeed and wish you the best for your company in those dark days.

the 39.99$ era is unknown to me, because even at that price I had to pay 70 bucks more to ship it home here in europe and not to mention the ebay price inflation. So I don't think I'm your classic customer but I think every euro collector would accept to pay more for new plane and recalibrate the balance betwen what we give to usps and what we give to the retaillers.

I also think anyone really interested in this hobby would prefer to pay more one new model instead to have 5xMD deal of a plane they already have.

There is a right price for everythings, collectors know that, I just hope we are enough...But I'm certain of one thing, increase your price and you will make our wife happy ( less plane at home and just the hoarder will disappear and stop asking gold on ebay just to drive to the next WM)

considering this paint scheme: it 's the first sabre I would like to have.

regards,
arnaud

[Tanker85]

Your out of line Sarge. Don't try to piss on the one manufacturer that has always been upfront and forthcoming with information about his business.
As for me and others, I'm sure, we are waiting patiently for any new releases that may come in the future. Your opinion is noted about the industry, but don't make it a personal attack against a great guy and his business struggling against great odds to survive.

[P39time]

It's a dumb ass responce like Sarge's that keep people like Jason from giving us updates. I don't blame Jason, I would not come back in here either.

[skypirate]

Man, the post where Jason covered the costs to produce a model was really sobering.

The direction this thread has gone, makes me a tad regretful of my comments about Dragon producing too many Tiger I's. I suppose the thing to keep in mind is there are always new customers coming into the hobby, who might also want to buy those models too.

Having Admiral in town is the best part of every payday and it's saved me a fortune in shipping costs.

In my opinion, Admiral's recent promotional offer might have worked. At least for me. I'm more focused on WWII, european theater items and WWI planes, but getting the CL-13 has piqued my interest in getting some of the other F-86's. I'm on board for at least one of the new F-86's, maybe a second for my dad.