The 21st B-25 Price discussion

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tmanthegreat
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Post by tmanthegreat » Sat Apr 07, 2007 10:12 am

I agree with your logic, however, 21c only makes up a small portion of Wal Marts overall toy sales. Even if their products sell poorly, Wal Mart is still making much more with Star Wars, Barbie and Spiderman toys.

The main problem with 21c toys not selling is due to the Wal Mart distribution pattern. The places where we saw halftracks or Avengers getting severely discounted after the holidays were stores that had 20 or more of the same products. Other stores never got any. I never saw a fabled pile of Avengers in my area, but did see one of 60+ halftracks. There is no way ONE store will sell that many of the same aircraft or vehicle! After the holidays, only about 15 of the halftracks had gone, and the rest sat around until discounted below $15.

A standard shipment of 4-8 (1 to 2 caseloads) is all the store needs to get at one time and they should be more evenly distributed. I really do not get why Wal Mart, as a corporate organization, does not get this! Look at what TRU does with its 1:18 BBI products, or what Target does with its FOV. TRU, for example, doesn't have 20 BBI "Old Crow" P-51s sitting around they have at most half that number, if even that!

A smaller, more even distribution pattern is what is really needed for 21c products to sell.
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Post by Birddog » Sat Apr 07, 2007 10:31 am

I feel we should just be happy a B-25 is being done. Boy what I'd give just to know an A-10 was being done like all the B-25 fans now know a B-25 is being done.

I think everyone here should expect to pay more for a B-25 than they did the Avenger. How much more I don't know, but I would think at least more than $100 for one. It's a larger aircraft for one and there will be a heck of alot more areas to detail. I'm sure 21st knows by now the level of detail they have to obtain for a partiular aircraft to please fans so I'm sure you can count on that aspect being covered. If they didn't everyone would then be complaining about the lack of detail compared to other aircraft and how they would have paid more if this or that had been done. Of course they may also complain how they should have paid less since it didn't have this or that.

If they can price it the same as the Avenger, God Bless Them, if they can't, it wouldn't stop me from buying one if it were an aircraft that I really want in my collection. I'd be very happy it was made.... :wink: :D
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Post by tpa05 » Sat Apr 07, 2007 12:40 pm

B-25 = F-4 if both are on the same shelf. They'd be $20 more than the Avenger and money will still be made on both ends.

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Post by wreckchaser » Sat Apr 07, 2007 4:33 pm

tmanthegreat wrote:

I never saw a fabled pile of Avengers in my area, but did see one of 60+ halftracks. There is no way ONE store will sell that many of the same aircraft or vehicle! After the holidays, only about 15 of the halftracks had gone, and the rest sat around until discounted below $15.
I saw the same deal a couple of years ago,except that they were 1/32 German tanks. I counted at least 50 and may have missed some due to the fact that they were scattered about. I wondered if there was a shipping error and that this WM had gotten a couple of other stores shippment as well as their own :?
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Post by Threetoughtrucks » Sat Apr 07, 2007 8:23 pm

tpa05:

You insist that WM is not going to carry a toy over $100 because the general toy buying public will not buy them, and that is just wrong.

Who bought all those 1/6 RC Stuarts at WM? Who bought the flawed 1/9 21C RC Abrams at WM? same with the RC 1/6 Hummer? Few of the last couple were dicounted very low, and the discounted items were usually because of running problems and didn't sell at list.

Who bought the 1/6 White Scout Car and Command Car at TRU?

All these were listed for over $100, some a lot more?

Did collectors buy all the over $100 items? Hardly, little Johnnie Gimmee bought these and consider that TRU had these toys at a time, over $100 meant a serious outlay of cash. That is before $5 cups of coffee and an outlay of $50,000 meant a Benz, not a lousy Ford or Chevy. :roll:

As you like to say... PERIOD.

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Post by GooglyDoogly » Sun Apr 08, 2007 3:40 am

Birddog wrote:I feel we should just be happy a B-25 is being done. Boy what I'd give just to know an A-10 was being done like all the B-25 fans now know a B-25 is being done.

I think everyone here should expect to pay more for a B-25 than they did the Avenger. How much more I don't know, but I would think at least more than $100 for one. It's a larger aircraft for one and there will be a heck of alot more areas to detail. I'm sure 21st knows by now the level of detail they have to obtain for a partiular aircraft to please fans so I'm sure you can count on that aspect being covered. If they didn't everyone would then be complaining about the lack of detail compared to other aircraft and how they would have paid more if this or that had been done. Of course they may also complain how they should have paid less since it didn't have this or that.
Amen.

We keep demanding they make bigger and better planes, well time for us to put our money where our mouth is! :twisted:

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B-25

Post by digger » Sun Apr 08, 2007 7:02 am

We keep demanding they make bigger and better planes, well time for us to put our money where our mouth is!
Agreed.

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Re: B-25

Post by pickelhaube » Sun Apr 08, 2007 8:10 am

digger wrote:
We keep demanding they make bigger and better planes, well time for us to put our money where our mouth is!
Agreed.
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Post by tpa05 » Mon Apr 09, 2007 10:15 am

Threetoughtrucks:

I'd like to take this opportunity to thank you for so vehemently supporting the very same points I made in my first entry to this thread. I'm not sure your intention was to re-enforce these points but indeed your last comments do just that. Again, thanks for your support.

If I might refresh your memory, in my first entry I stated the following:
Most of the toys that approach $100 "do something"...
I believe that most of the examples you provided in your last reply are just that! If it's RC it moves around no? To be sure, there are a number of items that cost more than $100 but again they provide the customer with more than a shelf display. For those that are not RC, can they be "played with"? For example, with some of the larger vehicles, figures can be inserted inside and the vehicle itself can be moved around (played with). I've watched these things get manhandled throughout the yards of my neighborhood and for the money (in this case) they're worth it!

Mr. Trucks, you continue to reference TRU. Why? We go to Walmart to save money no? Well you can be sure that ain't gonna happen at any TRU I know of. Here's one way of looking at it; when you go to TRU you need to be careful when pulling into the parking lot as there's usually a few kids running around and the cars are parked haphazardly (I'm not sure why). One thing you can be certain of however is that while your car may leave unscathed, your wallet will most surely leave with a dent in it. Did you really expect Walmart prices at TRU? Two different things altogether my friend.

Tmanthegreat - a homerun as you are correct in your response regarding Walmarts distribution system. There's another thread in itself (and I think it is one no?). Not much needs to be done to expand on that as again you're right.

I think there are actually two arguments being made here. The first is what the aircraft is worth to us (the collector). The second is what the price might be if sold at Walmart. Again, we need to be clear as to which is argument is being made here. What is it worth to us? That one is simple - whatever we are willing to pay. Just ask anyone (myself included) who's been waiting for the Phantom. Rumor has it a few people are looking for an A-10 :) . Again, it's worth whatever we are willing to pay.

But how much will it cost if sitting on the shelf at Walmart? Different story there amigos as there are alot of other factors that need to be considered and perhaps outside the purvue of this particular thread.

So what should we expect? If the '25 is gonna sit on the same shelf as the $89 Phantom then I expect the price to be no more than that. Yup, it may be more detailed and I'm sure it'll sell for more than the phantom on e-tailers websites but again it's a different market there.

More than $100 - at Walmart? Not when you've got others comming down the pike as well. If we are to indeed see a pricetag for more than $100 then it better be something more than something nice to look at - pah pah pah PERIOD!

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Post by wise690 » Wed Apr 11, 2007 5:54 pm

tpa05: I think there are actually two arguments being made here. The first is what the aircraft is worth to us (the collector). The second is what the price might be if sold at Walmart. Again, we need to be clear as to which is argument is being made here. What is it worth to us? That one is simple - whatever we are willing to pay. Just ask anyone (myself included) who's been waiting for the Phantom. Rumor has it a few people are looking for an A-10 . Again, it's worth whatever we are willing to pay.
You make a very good point. I would gladly fork over upwards of $100, being that I see it as a collection piece, however the average consumer will view it as a 'toy' and therefore, not be willing to pay as much.

The one thing I'm concerned about is 21st getting these things on the shelf soon. I hope this isn't a repeat of the Aevneger production.
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Post by VMF115 » Wed Apr 11, 2007 8:35 pm

I have noticed two things in the last three weeks; my landlord is trying to sell the house I rent. “ I still don’t know where I am going to live :cry: :cry: ” but many of the people that have looked at the house have committed to the realtor, and asked where did I get those big models? …
I know they look like toys at WM but when they are out of the box they take on a different level.

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