21C Trends?

Rowsdower · Post by **Rowsdower** » Tue Mar 27, 2007 1:33 pm

I will say this though. I would be perfectly content if WM carried a large amount of XD releases. Then it wouldnt be a problem picking up a few figures or a vehicle online. But 99.9% of the time, WM has NOTHING! So your are forced to buy online and spend $10-$20 or more than retail, plus shipping, plus you can't hold the box in your hands and look for defects like you can at the store.

Its the fact that WM is SUPPOSED to have this stuff but doesn't which ticks people off. People are buying online because because its the only option.

digger · Post by **digger** » Tue Mar 27, 2007 2:48 pm

The problem with online retailers for the most part is that they mark up the price too high.....It is easy to say that we should use the online shops, however, they do not have what we want for the most part.

That's your mistake - you think the WM prices are the regular prices - they are the discount prices. Like razors that are $4 at the grocery store but only $2.50 at WM - there stuff is cheaper, not the other guys have "marked it up too much." Also, what aside from the new figs do you want that you can't get online? The new 104? The new P-40s? Flight 19 Avengers?

Rowsdower wrote:Its the fact that WM is SUPPOSED to have this stuff but doesn't which ticks people off. People are buying online because because its the only option.

Who says WM is SUPPOSED to have it?? The WM flier? The website? Who says that??

Rowsdower · Post by **Rowsdower** » Tue Mar 27, 2007 3:45 pm

digger wrote: Who says WM is SUPPOSED to have it?? The WM flier? The website? Who says that??

The tags on the shelf that say 1:18 aircraft selection, 1:18 vehicle selection and 1:18 figures.

And if the WM price is "discounted" and online prices reflect the "true price" then that is still reason for people to wish they could find the stuff "discounted" at WM.

lightning2000 · Post by **lightning2000** » Tue Mar 27, 2007 4:34 pm

Easy guys,
No reason to go after the jugular. I think that Digger is simply trying to point out that even though WM may have the lowest prices going for XD, you're paying a price in a sense by not having it readily available. You have to understand that these types of collector-oriented products make up a tiny fraction of WM's sales. If it has no bearing in the context of a new movie, high profile license, or Xmas-selling season, then WM really could care less about these items.

Besides running into bare shelves, you're also more than likely to run into product that's been tampered with by another interested party, and could therefore, quite possibly, be missing pieces or damaged before you take it home.

Will the typical e-tailer sell the same item for more? Of course. E-tailers dont offer the same economy of scale and purchasing power as a WM. You simply cant expect to pay the same prices online that you would at a WM. The only time you might is when an e-tailer is running a clearance sale to reduce inventory.

You also have to remember that with gas prices again on the rise, you could be spending an awful lot on hidden charges that you could avoid by ordering online. Going to 4 or 5 WMs has to cost at least a quarter of a tank of gas, which can certainly affect your mindset in regard to pricing.

To make a long story short, the typical e-tailer will usually have a better in-stock status than a WM. Even though you're paying for shipping, you'll probably get something intact instead of possibly being opened, and the peace of mind knowing you finally have something you've been seeking for an awfully long time.

Lightning2000
www.themotorpool.net

scbvideoboy · Post by **scbvideoboy** » Tue Mar 27, 2007 5:02 pm

I guess I'm lucky that all the wm's in a 5 county area are available to visit during my normal work day. I have everything I want to buy right now.

It's been the same way for years, now many winter stukas and spitfires I passed on "I get that later" and bam were gone and never seen again.

I don't know production numbers, (secret) but I would imagine the numbers would be a little low to avoid stock being returned. Collector items are supposed to be low volume and rare.

Dave

digger · Post by **digger** » Tue Mar 27, 2007 5:24 pm

Thanks for some perspective Lightning.
VMF made the same point about wasting gas...I think some people are gluttons for punishment. Or maybe the prospect of a $2 Avenger keeps them on the hunt.

I am not quite sure but I bet the Online retailer's wholesale price is pretty close to what WM sells for, so Rowsdower maybe because the stuff is discounted is why the shelves are empty - it has sold out. I think it is better for us if the stuff generally sells out than if it is overstocked and sits around (Atlantic Avengers, BoB...).

Morian Miner · Post by **Morian Miner** » Tue Mar 27, 2007 5:53 pm

Another support for digger's argument. Figure what you make an hour, then figure what the 15 min. wasted going to a Walmart and finding nothing costs. If you make $20 an hour, its like you've wasted $5 each trip. Now add gas on top of that, and really quick etailers look pretty attractive.

Personally, I'm a glutton for punishment. I enjoy rummaging through the toy section seeing what's there. And since I collect other stuff, I hope I find something. Also, I've been hunting SW figures so long, not finding XD is just par for the course .

lightning2000 · Post by **lightning2000** » Tue Mar 27, 2007 6:00 pm

Hi,
Sometimes I think it has less to do with collecting than it does with the driving force behind collecting. As a vendor, we sometime sit in the catbird seat, watching with amazement what drives people to collect these things. For instance, some people need to be the very first person to have it in their possession. Why? Dunno. Maybe it has to do with bragging rights, the first on the block syndrome, or whatever.

Others will wait out an item until they think its hit a rock bottom price, only to find out that when its time to place their order, its now sold out. Then they vent, and kick themselves, and swear they'll never do it again, at least until the next time a similar item comes along.

I guess it takes all kinds to make up this hobby. I just wish that from a personal standpoint more people would just take the time to sit back and enjoy what they have, instead of worrying about how the next version will be painted, when it will come out, where they have to go to get it, etc.

I remember discussing this phenomenon with the president of a world reknown diecast manufacturing company thats been in the business a LONG time. Want to know what he said? He said its the thrill of the hunt, much like to trying to get a date with the most popular girl in school. Once you have it under your belt, s/he moves on to the next prospective conquest, then the next, and so on. Never mind they own something someone else would pay a king's ransom to call their own. Shame cause there's so many things coming out that are truly spectacular if only they would stop and smell the roses.

Enjoy what you have friends instead of getting yourselves nuts over the next hot commodity...

Lightning2000
www.themotorpool.net

Rowsdower · Post by **Rowsdower** » Tue Mar 27, 2007 6:22 pm

Morian Miner wrote: Personally, I'm a glutton for punishment. I enjoy rummaging through the toy section seeing what's there. ?

Yeah It's the same with me.

I've been thinking about it and Digger and lightning both make good points and I am going to heed everyones advice and stop stressing over Wally. Checking out the XD while I'm already at the store is ok but going back over and over to multiple WM's hoping to find a new piece, forget that. It's worth the bit of sanity that buying online saves.

I'm getting into 1:32 scale as well so I won't be just focusing on XD. Theres a lot of older FOV and 32x stuff I need to find.

STUKA · Post by **STUKA** » Tue Mar 27, 2007 8:09 pm

The Hunt is what makes this enjoyable for me - I care less about gas - all apart of the game - WM builds gas stations in their parking lot for us XD collectors.
I work at night and have children - so I can hit about 3-4 stores usually every other night as I'm picking milk and juice for the kids in the morning.

I also pick up starwars here and there - and used to pick up GiJoe -
My kids love thomas the train and cars - so I get to make the rounds -

last night for example - found the new 30th starwars cards and was able to pick up the clone marine - decked out in purple - I figured he would be hard to find -

I don't understand the idea that the online retailers mark up the XD up in price - each individual store should be allowed to mark up their stock as much as they want - if their product is marked up too high - then well the consequence is we won't buy it.
It appears that the price we see is what we are willing to pay for the items thus keeping them in business. My only issue with the online shopping is the shipping - but if I want something bad enough then I'm gonna pay for the shipping - all apart of the game - like buying gas -

Now if only the online stores can figure out how to build gas stations in their servers......

wait a minute - I read the WM Flier!!

also

see book of Walton for info on WM and XD.
ok im done

Rowsdower · Post by **Rowsdower** » Tue Mar 27, 2007 8:41 pm

STUKA wrote:WM builds gas stations in their parking lot for us XD collectors.

Holy cow I never thought of it that way! It all makes sense now!

Hell, my neighborhood WM even has a Subway to sustain the hungry XD searcher.

I wonder how long before I succumb once more to the XD aisles siren song.

tkjaer21 · Post by **tkjaer21** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 6:26 am

Rowsdower wrote:I will say this though. I would be perfectly content if WM carried a large amount of XD releases. Then it wouldnt be a problem picking up a few figures or a vehicle online. But 99.9% of the time, WM has NOTHING! So your are forced to buy online and spend $10-$20 or more than retail, plus shipping, plus you can't hold the box in your hands and look for defects like you can at the store.

Its the fact that WM is SUPPOSED to have this stuff but doesn't which ticks people off. People are buying online because because its the only option.

I agree 110%. This is what I always do. I always look at the boxes and inspect them.

tkjaer21 · Post by **tkjaer21** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 6:53 am

By the way, having a wife come home and find a large package with XD in it is the main reason why I try to limit my online purchases. The convienence of buying the item(s) I want on my own time and being able to not let the wife see the big box is worth more to me. She doesn't mind the cost, it is the hobby that drives her nuts as it takes up a lot of space.

Now if there was any way that we could get a deal worked out with Hobbytown for example to buy from the e-tailers for us as a special order. That, I would spend extra for. My local Hobbytown refuses to carry 1:18.

Rowsdower · Post by **Rowsdower** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 6:56 am

tkjaer21 wrote:By the way, having a wife come home and find a large package with XD in it is the main reason why I try to limit my online purchases.

Yeah the huge cardboard box can sure cause problems sometimes.

sarge · Post by **sarge** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 9:09 am

digger wrote:I still don't see how you guys are so tortured by WM...if there is something you want, go online and buy it. The MiGs on ebay are about $35 before S&H...really not that bad. Only the figures are impossible to find. If you refuse to shop online then that is your problem..you have to realize that online is a distribution outlet, whether you like it or not.

As for
"What's the matter with the other retailers like Target,Kmart TRUS ect? They used to be in there why now just WM?"
- you don't think 21C, AT or bbi would love to get picked up by another major retailer?? I think it is the stores calling the shots on that one...

It's not that were so tortured by WM. If it's something I want bad enough I will and have went on line for it. What every body is PO'd about is when 21C announced the BIG partenership with WM that was supposed to be the best thing since sliced bread. Two years down the line we can't find 21C in WM except on rare occassions. As some one stated before it sure would be nice to go to WM pick up what you want and go home or if they don't have it then know that they'll be gettting it in. Not the BS that's going on now.

digger · Post by **digger** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 10:18 am

Announced a big partnership? I don't remember a big announcement but I think we all know WM is the major retailer post TRU. To say people find stuff on rare occassions is just not true. WM is where most people got their P47s, Spits, and P40s longer than 2 years ago. Most people got their USMC, Japs, Avengers their too. Plenty of people got their M16s, hanomags, WC-51, M113 and Nightfighters their too. What about diecast Shermans, diecast Tigers, RC Panzers?
Just look at the pole and see how many people shop locally - safe to say that usually means WM.

toyktdlgh · Post by **toyktdlgh** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 10:52 am

I must admit there is a bit of a drop of in what Wal Mart is stocking right now but most of my collection did come from there. Almost all my figures and most of my planes once graced their shelves. I think we tend to forget that it was the Wal Mart partnership that saved 21C from going down the tubes. I liked it when TRU had their stuff but that partnership is over now and Wal Mart just stocks what they want to when they want to. That’s life. At least the product is available and we can buy it online if necessary. I for one am glad the stores have dropped off a bit recently. I am broke from all the new stuff that just came out and need some time to recoup and catch up. Lots of new stuff will be here soon enough.

tko211 · Post by **tko211** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 12:33 pm

I have to agree with Digger and Toyktdlgh.

I do dream of day when we see XD in more than one local mass retailer. Someday perhaps. Meanwhile, I am just glad that 21st has continued to make some really great toys. Some of them might have never seen the light of day otherwise.

-TKO

luftpanzer · Post by **luftpanzer** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 3:31 pm

Really WM stocks this stuff. A lot of the new stuff thats been out for months or a year in both scales I have not seen at all 3 of my WMs. And I stop by them twice a week.

tmanthegreat · Post by **tmanthegreat** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 3:38 pm

luftpanzer wrote:Really WM stocks this stuff. A lot of the new stuff thats been out for months or a year in both scales I have not seen at all 3 of my WMs. And I stop by them twice a week.

I think its that way all around. Still no Avengers in my area, even though they aparently went to a smaller town 40 miles down the highway

What is almost just as annoying is the fact that one store will get a ton of stuff, while another will be dry, and then with the next big release, they will switch. That really makes it tricky to find stuff without driving all over the place every time.

It would be much easier (for us collectors at least) if 21c simply sold new items to the small retailers first and then delivered to Wal Mart. That would get us our fill and Wal Mart would not be seriously hurt, especially since the bulk of their 21c product sales are made by regular customers.

immeww2 · Post by **immeww2** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 3:41 pm

I look at 21c products at WM being a big benefit. If I had to buy what I have in my collection currently on-line or at other places, I wouldn't have the mutiples of items that I do now to wargame and setup dios. WM is a blessing in disguise for 21c making it affordable for us collectors to obtain more than one of a particular item if we so choose. Granted, I agree with everyone that WM isn't up to par when it comes to distributing and offering 21c products for sale throughout the country, but I will continue to shop for 21c products at WM and bite the bullit when I can't find things there.

Folkwulfe · Post by **Folkwulfe** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 5:16 pm

Here's something that I haven't really understood about WM. They have a program (which I have used on occassion) where you can have something not available in your local WM shipped there if they have it "available". Usually that means something WM has on their e-site. I have asked and asked, but XD is NOT on their "availability" list. So here's the rub.....If WM was to get say Avengers at the distribution center, and wants them to sell quick, make them available for shipment to your local WM on request (even paid for in advance maybe?). That means there is a buyer waiting when it arrives and spends no time on-the-shelf gather dust and waiting to be discounted. WM saves shipping because it's not going to your house, and saves shelf space for things that move more quickly. The seeker gets what they want, WM gets their business......Seems like everybody wins. Now if we can just get WM to include XD in their program, I think alot more people would be happy...I know I would.

FieroDude · Post by **FieroDude** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 5:32 pm

That makes way too much sense. It'll never fly.

Rowsdower · Post by **Rowsdower** » Wed Mar 28, 2007 5:40 pm

FieroDude wrote:That makes way too much sense. It'll never fly.

You must have read the WM management book!

pickelhaube · Post by **pickelhaube** » Thu Mar 29, 2007 4:03 am

Folkwulfe wrote:Here's something that I haven't really understood about WM. They have a program (which I have used on occassion) where you can have something not available in your local WM shipped there if they have it "available". Usually that means something WM has on their e-site. I have asked and asked, but XD is NOT on their "availability" list. So here's the rub.....If WM was to get say Avengers at the distribution center, and wants them to sell quick, make them available for shipment to your local WM on request (even paid for in advance maybe?). That means there is a buyer waiting when it arrives and spends no time on-the-shelf gather dust and waiting to be discounted. WM saves shipping because it's not going to your house, and saves shelf space for things that move more quickly. The seeker gets what they want, WM gets their business......Seems like everybody wins. Now if we can just get WM to include XD in their program, I think alot more people would be happy...I know I would.

I have tried as well to no avail. I have even talked to the operator and gave here sugestions on how to do this and years later it has not changed.

Small Scale Military Headquarters

21C Trends?

xd & wm

Re: xd & wm

Product Availability

xd

Collecting

Re: ?

?

A tickler...

Re: A tickler...