POST ALL JSE F-14 QUESTIONS AND DISCUSSION HERE

toyktdlgh · Post by **toyktdlgh** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 10:25 am

Ha, this thread is cool. I can't help but check it every 5 min.

Its like a Soap.

Jericoeagle1 · Post by **Jericoeagle1** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 10:32 am

King O' Fools wrote: Are you somehow suggesting that THIS MODEL IS UNDERPRICED? I mean, really?

I am.

Compare it to other collectables out there such as the metal monsters of the Franklin Mint. Many of them costing 100 or more for 1/48 scale? Have you seen some of the 1/72nd collectables? Certainly, using your same scale of value they can't be worth the 30 to 75 dollar price tag that they fetch? The detailing with them is soft in many cases and most of them have few operating features.

Though I would agree on one point, leaving it (the F-14) unweathered would have been a better choice.

Imagine if the JSI was built in the USA, or Europe how much more would it cost?

Birddog · Post by **Birddog** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 10:33 am

Jericoeagle1 wrote:What a bunch of whiners. Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face.

I'm a realist not an apologist, I've 34 years of model building experience.
It may be damn well impossible to get someone to make 1/18 birds with all this nit picking and complaining. I'm a model builder and I know sometimes it costs $$$ to make a good competition award winning model. Take a 1/32 second scale model from Trumpeteer or Tamiya. Its unbuilt, unpainted and it in itself will cost over 100+. Lets not even talk about the extra's to make it look good, like custom decals, airbrushing, photo-etch parts etc. Whats your labor worth to you? Do I think its a fair price? Yes because I know what goes into making a model five times smaller then that

If you want a perfect model, toy, or collectable, be prepared to pay for it, that's what I"m saying. I've charged up to 3000.00 dollars for custom models I've done for others and felt justified for it based on what they wanted and the work I did and they are a lot of work. Factory issued assembly line models don't have that luxury of tasking perfection and keeping prices down. If I were to make the comparison between what I've seen on the F-14 now and the price. I'd say it was a bargain.

Look at what that one European company is charging to make exact replica's of your favorite planes, thousands. If you want that level of attention to detail be prepared to pay. 21st Century did us NO favors by selling stuff through WalMart. It created an unrealistic expectation of this hobby. Like many things in life if you want quality you have to pay for it. In this economy this is the reality so live with it. Me, I'm going to buy my big ole birds and enjoy them, because I know if wanted better I'd have to pay a lot more and probably do it myself anyway.

I agree with what you are saying Jericoe.

Speaking from the same experience you have, as someone who has built many many model kits in the past, you hit the nail on the head. This thing is a bargain to me even with the possible weathering flaws. For a company to try and mass produce (and I mean on a scale bigger than a customizer) a model to the standards of a professional paint master model that was painted as a one of a kind by hand, I don't think it has turned out that bad. If you want expert painting with fine attention to detail, be prepared to pay those huge museum quality price tags. Those aircraft ARE painted individually by one person who has master model skills. It takes them a full year or more just to build one model.

Again on the price......It's not being sold in mass numbers at a large brick and mortar stores which means it won't have as high a production run in numbers. That means a higher price point from the start to recover manufacturing and development costs. Plus it's a large ass jet. Even with this factored in, it is not that much higher a price tag than what some of the F-18s and F-16s were selling for.

Birddog · Post by **Birddog** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 10:40 am

And yes, I agree also that maybe an unweathered paint scheme would have better served JSI to keep the majority of the unrest down....

King O' Fools · Post by **King O' Fools** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 10:42 am

OK, so I guess you guys are saying that we should be grateful we're getting the F-14 at all and that, at $230+, it's a bargain even with the polka dot paint job. Maybe they should charge $500 a pop for the special edition spot cats.

Ok, where can I buy JSI shares?

thatf14guy · Post by **thatf14guy** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 10:44 am

toyktdlgh wrote:Ha, this thread is cool. I can't help but check it every 5 min.
Its like a Soap.

very funny, very funny!

i want to let you guys in on a little secret, jsi at first wanted to charge between $500 to $750 for these planes, but since they felt that people couldn't afford those kinda of cost or pay that much they lowered their prices, so they may go under anyways.

King O' Fools · Post by **King O' Fools** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 10:54 am

Told ya, Santa has taken over JSI.

BTW, I thought you had forever damned them to the pits of hell (along with Bad Cat)? This is getting confusing.

Oh, wait, that was before apologizing profusely to both of them, after editing all your previous posts on this thread.

thatf14guy · Post by **thatf14guy** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 10:58 am

can't we all get along, after all their are poor children all around the world starving right now, like in china. or better yet making ugly tomcats. i don't know guys this just..... i mean we have a piece of 1/18 history here the first 1/18 f-14 tomcat with varible sweep wings, a massive 41.5 inches in length, and all we want to is kill it before it even has a chance to take flight. no one is perfect, not me, not jsi, badcat, our dumba.s president, no one, only god. but,

atleast wait til you can see what it looks like in real life before getting all upset, like dumbas. me did their for while, but shoot i realized , i want the damn thing flaws and all. and their is no point in getting upset with the dealers, hence me again, sorry, but if your not satisfied let the people who make it know--jsi.

thatf14guy · Post by **thatf14guy** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 11:00 am

King O' Fools wrote:Told ya, Santa has taken over JSI.

BTW, I thought you had forever damned them to the pits of hell (along with Bad Cat)? This is getting confusing. Oh, wait, that was before apologizing profusely to both of them, after editing all your previous posts on this thread.

i know, but thats just it, i'm not perfect, plus as a christian, you have to forgive people and forget, and get beyond that, otherwise i think the world would be a pretty horrible place.

Black_Dragon_One · Post by **Black_Dragon_One** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 11:06 am

only the market can tell... in the past wally world, tru did give a what we rat ass thought , because we as a group did not have much purchasing power... as some one on the board already wrote we even if we all buy two or three we might not make the plane profitible enough to get the f15 or su....

i get my share just incase jsp f14 is all we get...

all company must make a profit otherwise there is no use in opening a business.

may be u can hope that the 1st or 2nd wave make enough profit so that the quality of paint job goes toward u expectation also good for me....

just don't miss the boat on it if there is only 1 or 2 wave with the same qaulity paint job... on a side note the f18 and f16 went dirt cheap for $50 pop and we have not see any repaint yet... what that tell ya...both f18 & f16 did have much painting on them if i remember it right it is mostly plastic color... my collect is in storage so i have seen it for 3 years....

Black_Dragon_One · Post by **Black_Dragon_One** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 11:09 am

toyktdlgh wrote:Ha, this thread is cool. I can't help but check it every 5 min.
Its like a Soap.

on a side note i like the paited pirate structure thing u did on the u r avatar..

i need some time to build my 1:18 scale ww2 city... i also herd potter play set might be showing up in the state

Black_Dragon_One · Post by **Black_Dragon_One** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 11:12 am

thatf14guy wrote:
toyktdlgh wrote:Ha, this thread is cool. I can't help but check it every 5 min.
Its like a Soap.

very funny, very funny!

i want to let you guys in on a little secret, jsi at first wanted to charge between $500 to $750 for these planes, but since they felt that people couldn't afford those kinda of cost or pay that much they lowered their prices, so they may go under anyways.

for that would suck i want my f15 and su please u can pant them pink for all i care

Post by **aferguson** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 11:12 am

sorry but by absolutely no stretch of the imagination is this thing underpriced. It's not a one off model. It is a mass produced item. The whole point of mass producing is to lower the per unit cost. Fine. This is still expensive. And that's fine too if it is a nice model. I'm not asking for perfection...not even close. But this thing has big splotches all over it. They don't look like weathering, the look like big splotches and they completely ruin the apperance of the aircraft, at any price.

It is hardly nit picking to complain about big dark grey spots randomly painted all over an otherwise decent plane. This is not the Seinfeld episode with the one tiny red spot on the white sweater. This is a sweater peppered with red spots.

The thing looks like it has low viz chicken pox. It is a disgrace to produce something like this.......absolutely a disgrace and doubly so at the price point and to state otherwise is untenable.

Black_Dragon_One · Post by **Black_Dragon_One** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 11:18 am

aferguson wrote:sorry but by absolutely no stretch of the imagination is this thing underpriced. It's not a one off model. It is a mass produced item. The whole point of mass producing is to lower the per unit cost. Fine. This is still expensive. And that's fine too if it is a nice model. I'm not asking for perfection...not even close. But this thing has big splotches all over it. They don't look like weathering, the look like big splotches and they completely ruin the apperance of the aircraft, at any price.

It is hardly nit picking to complain about big dark grey spots randomly painted all over an otherwise decent plane. This is not the Seinfeld episode with the one tiny red spot on the white sweater. This is a sweater peppered with red spots.

The thing looks like it has low viz chicken pox. It is a disgrace to produce something like this.......absolutely a disgrace and doubly so at the price point and to state otherwise is untenable.

the dots is a new type of camouflage

NWarty · Post by **NWarty** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 11:21 am

aferguson wrote:The thing looks like it has low viz chicken pox

Too funny Aferg. Your post is "spot" on.

Thank you Thank you. I'll be here all week.

thatf14guy · Post by **thatf14guy** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 11:24 am

i beg your pardon, but i don't want jsi to go under, but if they don't get enough support--from us--the consumers, they probalbly will, and yes that would totally suck donkey balls. cause i want the f-15 and su-27. sorry if i came off the wronge way. but i plan on supporting the crap out of them. i just trying to tell certian people not to kill the messengers (the dealers), if they are not happy they should let jsi know, if jsi truly cares about their customers they will produce better aircraft in the future. me, i am happy with what i see, i can't wait to own that sucker, it will look good in my living room.

King O' Fools · Post by **King O' Fools** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 11:33 am

Bottom line is, with this kind of attitude, JSI (and any other manufacturer out there) can pretty much get away with everything they want (both price- and quality-wise). AT went out of their way to fix the Dauntless. Had they known discerning collectors were few and far between, they'd have gone along with their original release and would have spared themselves the trouble of correcting their prototype. And that was long before JSI started charging big bucks for their spot cat. Had they known they could get away with it so easily, AT could have tripled the price and sold the thing unpainted altogether.

Black_Dragon_One · Post by **Black_Dragon_One** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 11:38 am

King O' Fools wrote:Bottom line is, with this kind of attitude, JSI (and any other manufacturer out there) can pretty much get away with everything they want (both price- and quality-wise). AT went out of their way to fix the Dauntless. Had they known discerning collectors were few and far between, they'd have gone along with their original release and would have spared themselves the trouble of correcting their prototype. And that was long before JSI started charging big bucks for their spot cat. Had they known they could get away with it so easily, AT could have tripled the price and sold the thing unpainted altogether.

i think some one step on the wing or something on the proto type and that was the last i heard

NWarty · Post by **NWarty** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 11:39 am

Taken right out of Merit's mouth:

"The "Leopard spots" in question are just one of the in progress pictures amongst over 1,000 steps during the production. These "Leopard spots" are actually on purposely made darker at the stage when the picture is taken and will gradually or magically look lighter in color after more layers of paint be sprayed.

Please stay tuned to our web site for the transformation.
Again, we thank you for your support!"

Do ANY of you honestly believe that anything was done in regards to touching up the spots? Look at the in-production pics then look at the final, assembled model. Look at the edited photo that FerrariGTO put up a couple of pages back.

Post by **aferguson** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 11:39 am

Agreed. I said that already. If collectors send a message to the manufacturers that they can produce any second rate thing and command big bucks for it, just because a bunch of collectors are desperate for 1/18 product, then they will. It's little different than the way a heorine dealer treats his junkies.

I've been on here a looooong time. Anyone who knows me at all knows i'm not a grumbler and i have been for the most part very happy and content with the 1/18 items that have been produced over the years. I too want F-15's and Su-27's but not if they have spots on them too.

Wake up people. This thing looks bad. It is inexcusible that it looks the way it does. And unbelievable that it turned out this way given its $200 price tag; which if we all recall JSI refused to let dealers lower their prices on, since they didn't want to undervalue their product. Well, they've done that all by themselves with the paintjob.

King O' Fools · Post by **King O' Fools** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 11:46 am

NWarty wrote:Taken right out of Merit's mouth:

"The "Leopard spots" in question are just one of the in progress pictures amongst over 1,000 steps during the production. These "Leopard spots" are actually on purposely made darker at the stage when the picture is taken and will gradually or magically look lighter in color after more layers of paint be sprayed.

Please stay tuned to our web site for the transformation.
Again, we thank you for your support!"

Do ANY of you honestly believe that anything was done in regards to touching up the spots? Look at the in-production pics then look at the final, assembled model. Look at the edited photo that Black Lion put up a couple of pages back.

Well, as far as I can see, the red intake "danger" chevron-shaped marking in Merit's official pics seems to have been oversprayed with grey paint. So maybe there was some touch-up.

Bad news is the red doesn't look wheathered at all. It looks oversprayed with gray paint.

NWarty · Post by **NWarty** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 11:48 am

Boy it sure does look oversprayed

thatf14guy · Post by **thatf14guy** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 11:56 am

i don't know, but merit won't release anymore pics right now, i sent them another email begging them too. i'm starting to wonder again?

toyktdlgh · Post by **toyktdlgh** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 12:50 pm

Well I think the word is out that collectors aren’t pleased so they’re going to hide till the planes are all sent out. I was fairly confident that I wanted to keep this plane regardless but a piece of me says they should be taught a lesson on it. We really shouldn’t accept substandard items and just say “thanks for making” it while we bend over and take in the gas shoot.

$250 is a lot of mullah for a model plane and it really should have been done right. I guess I’m mostly wondering why it wasn’t. They had plenty of time to test and look it over. There is a huge discrepancy between the prototype and finished model. Now granted I’m not seeing the spots like I once did (maybe I need my glasses on) but there are no panel lines and lots of missing detail that was there in the prototype. That’s what we all thought we were buying. I mean, that was what the photo showed right?

I’m torn. On one hand I really want it flaws and all on the other I could buy two really nice 1930’s Philcos or some Chevy parts with that same cash. I’m a little concerned as to what will happen if we cancel. I mean, what will happen to the retailer? Will they be stuck with it? Or will JSI have to take them back? What happens if they fix the issue with run 2 and we are all stuck with sub standard planes? Hmm…

pcoughran · Post by **pcoughran** » Wed Dec 02, 2009 12:54 pm

thatf14guy wrote:i don't know, but merit won't release anymore pics right now, i sent them another email begging them too. i'm starting to wonder again?

This is better than a Soap. I'm busting out laughing at times reading this. It's all in good fun I hope for most of us.
thatf14guy - you wouldn't be related to Brett Favre would you?

Despite it's flaws, I'm getting one of these. My 9 year old son wants it as his "big" Christmas present. As far as I'm concerned it's better than getting him an XBOX360 or such. He was a VF-84 pilot for halloween. He has all the gear and everything. Even though he's a kid, he'll notice any "overspray" and "spots" if they are there. He made me repaint his PTE Warthog cause it didn't look "real" enough. Hopefully I won't be repainting this bad boy.

Merry Christmas.