For XD18 vets; which 21C Sherman do I have?

nfafan · Post by **nfafan** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 7:58 am

Question for those who have been around XD18 for awhile...

I missed out on all of the all-plastic Series 1 XD18 armor years ago, when XD18 was readily available in TRU stores.

I later discovered the 21C Ultimate Soldier Fan Club, and in 2002 I ordered my 1st XD18 tank via the Club - the Army OD Sherman vs. the 3-color cammo Sherman I could have also ordered.

I recvd an all-plastic M4 Sherman with "Bushmaster" on the hull sides and "758" on the turret sides. Also on the turret on the commander's side is a "hat in the ring" graphic, and on the opposite side of the turret are 3 little Jap. "kill flags" - like you'd see on a Wildcat. Plus the usual US Army stars and vehicle number.

So the questions please;

1.) Is this a Series 1 Sherman? Series 2?

2.) Was this "Bushmaster" version ever available in TRU stores?

3.) Am I the only one who doubts the accuracy of these markings on an M4?

TIA!

Quixote511 · Post by **Quixote511** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 8:11 am

It is Series 3 as far as I know. Series 2 was the original COED plastic you could order through the fan club. The markings are spot on if I remember correctly.

tkjaer21 · Post by **tkjaer21** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 9:45 am

The COED Scheme is the best to me as it is the only one that came with a removable helment on the figure. Also the fact that I got mine at Wal-Mart for only $9.00.

Website · Post by **Teamski** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 1:56 pm

Quixote511 wrote:It is Series 3 as far as I know. Series 2 was the original COED plastic you could order through the fan club. The markings are spot on if I remember correctly.

Yep, that was S-3. It is an army Pacific paint scheme while COED is Marine.....

-Ski

grunt1 · Post by **grunt1** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 2:02 pm

What are the differences between the fan club COED and the Walmart COED?

Quixote511 · Post by **Quixote511** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 2:10 pm

Fan club COED is plastic. WM COED is diecast.

pokeyjtc · Post by **pokeyjtc** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 3:24 pm

I got my COED Sherman at WM and it is plastic, not die-cast metal. The WM BOB Sherman I have is die-cast metal.

STUKA · Post by **STUKA** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 7:17 pm

my coed was $5.00

from WM and it is not dicast.

grunt1 · Post by **grunt1** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 8:37 pm

pokeyjtc wrote:I got my COED Sherman at WM and it is plastic, not die-cast metal. The WM BOB Sherman I have is die-cast metal.

Same here. I have two Walmart COED Shermans that are both plastic. My two Walmart/Motorworks Shermans are diecast.

Here are all of the Shermans I'm aware of..

Original Toys R Us Sherman:

Fan Club Exclusive "Tophat" Bushmaster

Walmart Motorworks BoB Sherman (Diecast)

Walmart COED

Most current Sherman (you can still find at small retailers)

And the unreleased prototype:

nfafan · Post by **nfafan** » Fri Mar 23, 2007 8:57 pm

Teamski wrote:
Quixote511 wrote:It is Series 3 as far as I know. Series 2 was the original COED plastic you could order through the fan club. The markings are spot on if I remember correctly.
Yep, that was S-3. It is an army Pacific paint scheme while COED is Marine.....

-Ski

Thanks all for the replies and pics of the 21C Sherman releases.

And also for the confirmation on the "Army Pacific" scheme... I thought the markings were a bit bogus...

It looks like 21C took a couple of pics of PTO M4 composite hull Shermans - see Squadron "Shermans in Action", page 33 - and came up with "Bushmaster 758". Regardless, since it was a "fan club exclusive", I'll live with it as is.

pickelhaube · Post by **pickelhaube** » Sat Mar 24, 2007 6:46 pm

Back in the day wal-mart had these for $5 as well in my locale . They had about 10 of them . I passed and did not get a singal one. DOOOOOHHHH!!!

momaw nadon · Post by **momaw nadon** » Sun Mar 25, 2007 12:47 am

grunt1 wrote:What are the differences between the fan club COED and the Walmart COED?

Okay, when I was trying to get my hands on the Wal-Mart version that I passed on, I had to see if there was difference other than the figure and box. This is what I found.

First: the AA 50cal/antenna is not glued in place on the Wal-Mart version. You cannot remove the one on the Fan Club version without breaking it that I know of. Have 2 S1 Shermans that have broken mounts from trying to remove them.

Second: Paint, the colors are the same or they are close enough to look alike that there is no noticable difference, but the Wal-Mart version has more over-spray and the camouflage goes all the way to the ground in the same pattern that is on the hull. Fan Club version has more green showing, and the pattern is less on the road wheels if there is any at all and doesn't follow the hull pattern as well as the Wal-Mart version. Both Patterns are the same as to the placement of the tan and green. They match up almost perfectly.

I haven't noticed anything else, but when I have them both out I'll go over them with a fine-tooth comb and let the board know. BTW I have 2 of each to compare and that is what I noticed on all of them. If anyone can add to this, I would like to know what you have found.

Conclusion: I like the figure better with the Wal-Mart version do to the helmet and articulation, but the paint on the Fan Club version is much better looking. As the Wal-Mart is too tan and it's like lower quality, but isn't if that makes sense. Overall the Fan Club is the winner IMO.
momaw nadon

grunt1 · Post by **grunt1** » Sun Mar 25, 2007 8:32 am

That was a great help Momaw. Please post pictures when you have a chance (I'd like to use them in the database too if that's ok).

When you say the figures are different, was the fan club the one without the removable helmet from the european theater that came with all the to other Shermans? I seem to recall the Walmart version had the marine with removable helmet.

Oh and what were the differences in the boxes? (Color wise, again photos would be great!)

nfafan · Post by **nfafan** » Sun Mar 25, 2007 11:40 am

grunt1 wrote:That was a great help Momaw. <snip>
When you say the figures are different, was the fan club the one without the removable helmet from the european theater that came with all the to other Shermans? I seem to recall the Walmart version had the marine with removable helmet.

Oh and what were the differences in the boxes? (Color wise, again photos would be great!)

FWIW, my fan-club Bushmaster Top Hat M4 came in the brown Ultimate Soldier XD box, as seen in the first pic Momaw gave us.

The lone figure has the tanker's helmet molded as part of his head.

The TC's .50cal pintle is solidly fixed, it will rotate but cant be removed as mentioned. Neither can the antenna base on the turret, or the .50cal "barrel lock post" in front of the TC hatch.

The tank itself - entire hull, turret, gun, bogie trucks - the "whole tank", is molded thru/thru in a greenish OD plastic. No paint or weathering.

Only paint used on the entire tank are the markings and on the figure, stowage and tools, and rubber tires of the roadwheels.

Tracks are molded in black rubberry vinyl, no weathering. (And BTW; aside from the lack of weathering - look identical to BBI's Sherman tracks.)

HTH

momaw nadon · Post by **momaw nadon** » Sun Mar 25, 2007 1:27 pm

grunt1 wrote:That was a great help Momaw. Please post pictures when you have a chance (I'd like to use them in the database too if that's ok).

When you say the figures are different, was the fan club the one without the removable helmet from the european theater that came with all the to other Shermans? I seem to recall the Walmart version had the marine with removable helmet.

Oh and what were the differences in the boxes? (Color wise, again photos would be great!)

I think this may be repeat, but the figure from the Fan Club COED is the Pacific theater Tanker with the swivel joints included with all Shermans (except S1) before the Wal-Mart COED. The figure that came with the Wal-Mart version is USMC Dizzy Hagenshire, but with a removable tanker helmet.

Box for the Fan Club COED is the same as the S1 and S2 Shermans with whidows on both sides of the box. Plus it is taller than the Wal-Mart versions box to fit the 50cal/antenna etc in it.

Next time I have them both out I'll shoot you some pictures.
momaw nadon

red69charger · Post by **red69charger** » Sun Mar 25, 2007 2:11 pm

Several years ago , at the international hobby show in Chicago area, 21st Century sold 3 of the unreleased protoype vehicles. I bought 2 of them and another guy there bought the other 1. Not sure if there were any others but what is interesting is that none of the normally painted parts were painted. The machine guns and even the crates were just left in olive drab plastic. Unfortunately, not realizing that they would be unreleased, I opened both of them and threw away the boxes.

Not that I'm gonna sell, but I wonder what they'd fetch on ebay? I was somewhat disappointed when an unreleased Battle of the Bulge prototype winter painted barn I picked up at the same show only sold for $40 last year. The unreleased Sherman camo scheme looks pretty cool to me. I think it would sell well if they did actually mass produce them.

grunt1 · Post by **grunt1** » Sun Mar 25, 2007 5:21 pm

Can you post a photo of either the Sherman and/or the barn you sold?

As for value, if it is as described I imagine it would fetch a nice price to those that knew what it actually was..

ostketten · Post by **ostketten** » Sun Mar 25, 2007 7:49 pm

COED is pretty neat looking, but I think the weathered looking BoB motorworks diecast version is my fave. I also have one of those newer "clean green" versions around here someplace, the question is where...??

red69charger · Post by **red69charger** » Mon Mar 26, 2007 9:12 am

The unreleased Shermans look just like the photo already posted but I will try to take some pics of mine this week and get you some images from different angles than the stock photo.

red69charger · Post by **red69charger** » Wed Apr 11, 2007 7:01 pm

Sorry it took so long but I've been super busy at work. I took some photos of the 2 unreleased Shermans I own. My camera is not the greatest so the red brown didn't stand out as much I'd like but you can get the idea. Notice that nothing is painted on the vehicles except the camoflage pattern. The rubber part of the wheels, crates, infantry stowage bags, 50 calibre MG ... all left in bare plastic. I also posted a photo of one the Shermans while still in the box before I opened it (colors easier to see) and included photos of the winter hayloft as it appeared at the 2002 International Hobby Expo where I obtained all these things.

http://news.webshots.com/album/155718278EvLSFT

grunt1 · Post by **grunt1** » Wed Apr 11, 2007 10:44 pm

Thanks Red, very helpful..

Mind if I use these in the SSHQ database?

Razor17019 · Post by **Razor17019** » Thu Apr 12, 2007 6:28 am

red69charger wrote:Sorry it took so long but I've been super busy at work. I took some photos of the 2 unreleased Shermans I own. My camera is not the greatest so the red brown didn't stand out as much I'd like but you can get the idea. Notice that nothing is painted on the vehicles except the camoflage pattern. The rubber part of the wheels, crates, infantry stowage bags, 50 calibre MG ... all left in bare plastic. I also posted a photo of one the Shermans while still in the box before I opened it (colors easier to see) and included photos of the winter hayloft as it appeared at the 2002 International Hobby Expo where I obtained all these things.

http://news.webshots.com/album/155718278EvLSFT

I remember you posting before on the Winter Hayloft. Were you able to just buy these prototypes?? or did give them to you? How did you exactly obtain these items?

red69charger · Post by **red69charger** » Thu Apr 12, 2007 9:48 am

Feel free to use the images on your site.

At the 2002 Expo, 21st Century had advertised on Groundpounder's old site that they needed people to help setup and takedown their displays. I went along with a friend and gave assistance. At the Expo 21st also had pieces for sale (at wholesale prices). This was how I obtained the unreleased Sherman paint scheme. There were a total of 3 boxes that had the red brown paint scheme. I bought 2 of them and another guy next to me picked up the last one.

After the Expo was over, as a thank you for setting up and taking down, 21st gave the helpers there pick of many of the pieces left. I got a lot of the farmhouses and barns. One of those was the winter scheme barn that was never released. There were 2 of those at the Expo. I got one and somebody else got the other. I don't think 21st does this type of help/ giveaway anymore at their shows.

At the time I thought both of the barn and Sherman versions were going to be released soon so I didn't think that much of what I had ... thats why I opened up the boxed Shermans (too my current dismay). I remember commenting that since they hadn't painted the parts on the Shermans I didn't think they were going to sell well. Little did I know they were prototypes.

As I was going thru my old Expo photos I also noticed another Sherman that was there that was never released nor was it given away to my knowledge. It was weathered more heavily. I'll try to post photos of them in the next day or two.

red69charger · Post by **red69charger** » Thu Apr 12, 2007 4:16 pm

I put in some more of my old 2002 Expo photos of 1/18 XD. You can now see...

1. An unreleased weathered Sherman
2. The unreleased bridge prototype ... wide enough for 2 Shermans.
3. Interior and side shots of the unreleased government building.

Again grunt1, you may feel free to add any of these to your very useful website.

Razor17019 · Post by **Razor17019** » Thu Apr 12, 2007 7:37 pm

Wow! You were at the right place at the right time!

Do you remember if the barn was displayed with a low wall around it, as the box lid showed it having?

Did you notice if the bridge or Gov't/City Hall building were given away?

Did you ever try contacting 21C to see if they would like to "buy" back their Sherman prototype?

Thanks for sharing your story with us. It truely is amazing how items are aquired by the members of this board...

Small Scale Military Headquarters

For XD18 vets; which 21C Sherman do I have?

For XD18 vets; which 21C Sherman do I have?

Unreleased Prototype

Unreleased

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Re: Photos Finally Up

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