3D Printing -- Pretty Close to Ready

[gburch]

My Blackberry died this weekend (one of our animals peed on it, and the USB connection shorted out -- really ... ), so no pics. Which is too bad, because I had hoped to use the current build as an opportunity to do more detailed photo-documentation of the process for use if and when I ever offer this project to others ...

So a text-only update. The engine section and fins are now completely filled and primed and ready for painting. The aero-flaps on the fins are still an open item.

The tank section is assembled, surface-finished and primed, ready for painting. I used this version to update the design of some of the internal structural pieces. They're stronger and provide a better fit, but over-all print time did go up somewhat in the process. Those improvements will need to go through an optimization process to see if I can cut the print time down somewhat. I did use this build to see how fast I could go from a full set of printed parts to being ready to paint for the tank section, and did it in one day. Of course, this is my fourth full build, and I wouldn't expect someone else to be able to do that on their first try.

No new progress on the control section. I'm using the previous version's parts for test fitting. Hatches need some optimizing.

Warhead is as good as it's going to get, I think, and is printed, finished and waiting for a final primer coat before painting.

TBD: Nozzle insert and nozzle flap details, although some pieces experimented with on the latter.

With any luck, I'll have a working camera by next weekend and will post pics. I may be working on the splinter camo final painting by then.

[Jay]

Would you ever consider a situation were people could send you a cad file and you could print it out. I'm not sure how you would charge each job out though.

[gburch]

Would you ever consider a situation were people could send you a cad file and you could print it out. I'm not sure how you would charge each job out though.

Yes -- BUT -- it's not just a matter of plugging any old "cad file" into the printer and having a nice plastic part pop out. There are some limitations on what kind of file I can start with (must be a solid -- although you can use surface models, so long as they're "closed"). Parts have to fit within the print volume of the machine (currently a cube roughly 10cm on a side). And the 3D model needs to be designed with printing in mind or altered to accommodate limits of the printer (for example support during building, maximum overhangs, some issues with wall thickness too complex to go into here.)

What I could end up charging for something like that would depend on how much "optimizing" of this kind I'd have to do.

In an ideal world, I'd actually like to see it the other way around: I'd like to develop designs that are fully optimized and sell those to people who have their own printers. That would be the best leverage for everything I've learned. I know I may not live long enough to see that world, but I think it will happen some day ...

[Jay]

Well GB, you've inspired me enough to take the next step. I've bit the bullet and bought a full plastic parts set for a Prusa Mendel 3D printer. I'm hoping I haven't bitten off more than I can chew in terms of sourcing and assembling the electronic parts for the printer. I work at a manufacturing company so all the various threaded rods, nuts, bolts will be no problem. Will keep you posted.

[pickelhaube]

Well GB, you've inspired me enough to take the next step. I've bit the bullet and bought a full plastic parts set for a Prusa Mendel 3D printer. I'm hoping I haven't bitten off more than I can chew in terms of sourcing and assembling the electronic parts for the printer. I work at a manufacturing company so all the various threaded rods, nuts, bolts will be no problem. Will keep you posted.

I guess I am a dinosaur, this high tech stuff is just too much over my head. The uses of a 3D printer are boundless. I can see that.

There is also no way that I could set up the machine.

FORGET ABOUT PROGRAMING IT

I guess the next generation in model building has past me by.

[flyboy_fx]

YOu will live a longer life PH

All this high tech modeling just makes ya lazy. Just kidding of course.

[gburch]

Well GB, you've inspired me enough to take the next step. I've bit the bullet and bought a full plastic parts set for a Prusa Mendel 3D printer. I'm hoping I haven't bitten off more than I can chew in terms of sourcing and assembling the electronic parts for the printer. I work at a manufacturing company so all the various threaded rods, nuts, bolts will be no problem. Will keep you posted.

Congratulations -- and may God have mercy on you! My impression is that the Mendel is more "mutated" in the sense that there are lots more variations on the design out there, because there's no single source for the parts/kits/designs the way there is with the MakerBot. There's a big, active user base out there -- many thousands -- and many forums devoted to it. Again, these seem to be more "diffuse" because there's so much more variation in the Mendel family of printers. When you ask for help on those forums, be sure to be very specific about the mix of components you're using!

I'll be very happy to share whatever I may have learned along the way, although much of it will be somewhat "generic" since there are some fundamental differences in approach between the MB and the Mendel. You'll be using ReplicatorG for your machine control software, I presume, so some of what I figured out with that may be helpful.

I guess I am a dinosaur, this high tech stuff is just too much over my head. The uses of a 3D printer are boundless. I can see that.

There is also no way that I could set up the machine.

FORGET ABOUT PROGRAMING IT

I guess the next generation in model building has past me by.

Nope -- we're just clearing a path for you. I'd say that in no less than five years, the technology will be much more user-friendly and much of the fiddling that I've documented in this thread will be a thing of the past. As I've said before, personal 3D printing is about where PCs were in, say, 1978. But the advance to real "mass market" penetration will be faster than it was with PCs, because all the enabling technology is already available. For now, it's just a matter of getting it all to work together.

So ... an update ...

Here's'a pic of intermediate stage surface finishing on the engine section of the current version:

This pic shows some of the detailed putty work that's required to get the vents nice and smooth. Because they have a big overhang, the edge doesn't print perfectly smooth, so a little extra putty and sanding is required to gt a good, rounded and smooth vent cover.

Here's the engine section at about the same stage, from the other direction:

This shows the manual scoring of the edges of the panels. I experimented with doing some panels with and some without scoring in between each coat of latex paste filler and filler primer on the last version, and the results on the scored ones was much better. So I'm scoring all of them on each coat this time. It's somewhat time consuming until you get the hang of it, but as one of the pics below shows, the result is worth it.

All of the new rocket's components together for a group shot during a late stage of surface finishing:

The white spot about half way up on the tank section shows a place where the joint between two printed sections joined less-than-perfectly. But this goes away entirely after a few coats of filler-primer and moderate sanding.

Here's'a pic of the aero-flaps:

After a good deal of experimenting, I've realized that because the flaps are so small, it's best to print all four as a single piece, and also to do as much of the surface finishing as possible while they're still attached to the print base. Because they're so small, just slathering on green putty and sanding smooth makes this a quick and smooth job.

The rocket factory last night:

Detail on the new bird on the left got washed out, unfortunately, but ...

Here's'a pic of the bottom section of the new rocket with sharp shadows to bring out detail:

The hatches look very good. There' still a little unevenness on the one transition between skin sections. This will get one more sanding and priming before final paint.

I've decided to go ahead and develop an at least first pass at the nozzle flaps. Here's a pic of an experiment on a spare fin, mounting the flap in a movable fashion, that involves drilling a 1/4" hole in the fin at the proper location:

As you can see, I went a little too far with the drill, but this is easily fixable with putty, sanding and repriming.

The next step is inserting a piece of 1/4" styrene tubing:

3/16" styrene tubing fits snugly into this, and the flap will be attached to that and slide into the tubing glued into the fin and turn freely.

I'm swamped at work, so I don't know how much more I'll get done this weekend. But I'm having fun again, so it's all good!

[gburch]

No time for a a write-up. Instead, here's a series of pics showing the work leading up to what may be ...
. . . . . . Version 1.0!!!

Note: I have reached and surpassed the limits of my skills as a painter. I know someone else could do a much better job with this kit ...

[pickelhaube]

Now that camo is cooool !!!!!!!

[Beeavision]

Before long if you keep this up you'll have more rockets then NASA.

[gburch]

Before long if you keep this up you'll have more rockets then NASA.

I already do. As of last month, they don't have any

[Jay]

Well done sir, well done.

[CW4USARMY]

Your persistence has paid off. Those looks outstanding!

[flyboy_fx]

Damn.

[Panther F]

Awesome work!

Is there a waiting list for one?


- Jeff

[Bar]

Before long if you keep this up you'll have more rockets then NASA.

I already do. As of last month, they don't have any

No. They have plenty of rockets. They just don't have any more shuttles...

[gburch]

Awesome work!

Is there a waiting list for one?


- Jeff

Thanks. Not yet. I'm not yet ready to take the plunge into actually offering this as a kit.

Some of the major issues are:

• whether I will buy a second printer to serve as a "kit production" machine so I can continue to use the one I've got now as an "R&D" machine;
  whether there's a large enough group of people who are willing to master the techniques I've developed for surface finishing to address the "striations" that result from the printing process;
  whether I can figure out a price that is acceptable to a large enough group of people to make it worth my while.

[normandy]

gburch,
Couldn't you have started with a Schimmwagen or something like that? .....
I've watched your progress since November and its just been increadable.
The technical aspects of this process still have me a bit confused and troubleshooting problems with programs is beyond my realm, the model finishing.....no problem.
When these printers become more user friendly I'll look into getting one.

Your V-2's are outstanding! The amount of detail you were able put in these models is amazing when compaired to the IMEX 1:16 vac-u-form kit I built.
Great work!!!!!!!!

[fly-dk]

You should sell your early versions and use them to finance your future versions

I think many of us would love to buy one of your early versions

[gburch]

You should sell your early versions and use them to finance your future versions

I think many of us would love to buy one of your early versions

Maybe I should hold on to them in case they become collector's items

Seriously, I'm not nearly as good a modeler as some of the other folks on the board. I'm convinced other people could do a much better job with this than me.

[gburch]

A complete set of Version 1.0 parts:

[AMERICAN_GRENADIER]

really nice i would like to buy one thats completed when you get that far

[normandy]

It takes All those parts to make one of your V-2's....... no wonder my Vac-u-form kit looks like excrement (had to keep it PG).
I hope this technology gets you to the point that you are able to sell these V-2's.
I'm very impressed, nice work!!!

[gburch]

An example of what instructions might look like if i were ever stupid enough to offer the V2 as a model for sale (click to enlarge):



Note that, at this time, I imagine that instructions would be purely web-based.

A few points about the possibility of selling kits:

1. Production rate: I'm unlikely to ever be in a position in the next 1-2 years to be able to devote more than one bot to production of any single kit (I have dreams of others beside the V-2). Right now, it looks like the best I'd be able to do is an average of about one kit per week.

2. Kits vs. complete models: I can't envision me ever being in the model-making business for a couple of reasons. First, time devoted to making models is time I can't devote to developing new kits. The latter is what I'm much more interested in. Second, I am not a great modeler! There are great modelers in our community, and I'm not one of them. IF I were ever to get into the kit-selling business, the way people could get completed models is to commission them from the great builders: The price you'd pay would be a combination of what I charge for a kit, and what the builder charges to build your kit. If there were builders interested in this kind of arrangement, the people involved would have to figure out what the combined price would be.

3. Kit Price. I'm still not there. With any luck, I'll have an example of a "beta-build" from a really good modeler in a few months at most. I have to know how that process turns out before I can begin to set a price.

[Bar]

Beautiful. I am loving the instructions. Decent instructions make a good kit into a GREAT kit.
Bravo.