Anyone else prefer the older 21C figs?

[Morian Miner]

I came across the Vietnam figures at TRU today. I picked them up, looked at them for a moment, then just put them back. Its the same thing that I went through with the DAK figures when I first saw them. As great as the accessories you get and articulation are now, I find myself preferring the older XD figures. Specifically, the first Vietnam series, and the WWII figures that came out about that time. I liked have the heads cast in a flesh-toned plastic, and not with the heavy washes.

I figure I'm just being weird, and I'm sure I'll end up buying these guys (after all, I bought a bunch of the DAK figures, and ended up happy with them). But, I wonder if anyone else has thought the same thing.

[tmanthegreat]

I wouldn't say you're off the mark at all. I tend to like certain things about some of the older figures and certain aspects with the new as well. Some of the older S1 and BoB series figures tend to fit in vehicles better than the new figures (something about a seperate "tunic piece" on the new figures that makes it hard for them to sit or kneel). Then, however, the new figures have better articulation and often more accessories. I've decided that in the event I come across the new Vietnam figures, I will only buy one set as combined with the figures I already have, it should be enough. Then again, we'll see

[aferguson]

i think the older figures are more realistic lookng, due to the lesser articulation, especially in the shoulder areas. They're great for posing figures just standing around but less useful if you want more dynamic poses. I like the new leg/arm position options being offered now. Best of both worlds imo.

[MG-42]

* I personally , prefer the original or older ones opposed to the newer ones w/ one exception :

* I do like both the newer "Otto's" , alot ! *

Mitch _ v MG

[Sabrefan]

I really like the Patton figure that came with my Dodge command car. Not sure why I like that one so much, must be the flight jacket.

[Jesse James]

In short... No, I don't like the older figures more than the newer ones.

As toys, the poseability is everything to me, so the articulation is key... I can deal with the bad washes on the figures, and can fix that. Articulation however, cannot be fixed nearly as easily. Other advancements like removable headgear, and overall better sculpts IMO (more crisp detailing on today's figures than the originals by far and away) also add to why I like today's over the originals.

To me it's not even comparable. I sold my originals off for the most part, and I'm just as glad I did.

[Quixote511]

I like the head scuplts of the older figures much better. But, all of the gear and posability make the new ones nice.

[1958Zelda]

I agree with JESSE JAMES,but i do like the officer & machine gunner of the older figures.

[Jesse James]

I'd love a new MG trooper for the Germans... A nice separate belt of ammo, flexible if possible, and attachable to the gun itself, would be neat. Some ammo cans, maybe snap-on drums of ammo even... Sweet.

The officer I think was nicely replaced recently, but I'd dig seeing variations on the Officer with like white winter heavy pants (or autumn camo) with the tuniced top to show he's an officer...

They really a new MP40 and MP44 guy too... The GI's aren't exactly without needs either. A nice new squad leader would be neat with a Thompson and removable clip bag(s). Maybe a new Flamethrower. Some guys without the jacket on would be neat too, for Italian front and desert set-ups. Those DAK need someone to fight.

Everyone talks Brits, Russians and the like... And I'm right with you, trust me. I could take more US and Germans though, of varying types.

[Morian Miner]

Ugh, I wish the toy manufs. would get rid of the removeable clips. Especially Marauder. For 1/18, they don't add that much, and I just end up gluing them in place. I feel bad for any little kids playing with these with no access to crazy glue.

As for the added articulation, I think the manufacturer's need to tone back and consider when it hinders the figure to add more articulation. Not so much the military crowd, but Star Wars (Jedi Lukes with terrible looking boots to get the ankle articulation) and GI Joe (see either Duke with manboobs or the new Flash's chest protector, for ex). Sometimes, less is more.

[Jesse James]

But really, can you have it both ways? In one sentence you're saying glue in the removable clips (a feature I love personally, as an adult collector who enjoys "features" on his toys), but at the same time you're saying you should cut back on articulation on some toys (a feature that, as an adult collector I still enjoy, but articulation IS something kids like equally).

To me, the articulation isn't the problem on figures like Luke, and on the GI Joes I think it's Hasbro's intent to make a simply super poseable toy at a good price, to rekindle that aspect of the original GI Joe:ARAH... He was a revolutionary toy, for the most part, in his 1982 debut. And he also helped to kill lines like Star Wars at the time with his articulation.

But anyway, to me the problem's the sculpt... Luke's ankles and things can all look fine if the sculpt allows for it. Take into account the Death Star Trooper, who I love as a figure overall, but ultimately his joints are recessed into the sockets nearly as much as they should be, and so they're "noticeable" (best way to put it I guess). Less the fault of the articulation count though, and definitely a sculpting flaw.

On 21st's stuff, I think they've done great... The fact you get two sets of arms (and now legs) really negates complaints people make at this point about the "looks" of the toy. You have two choices, which is far more than any other toy line gives you, and for $5, which is pretty much cheaper than most comparable scale action figures today... No gripes here from me then on those fronts...

Paint aps though? Or accessory designs? 21st has room for improvement I think, at really no added overall costs to the toy itself, just by some redesigning or some more careful decisions on decorations.

That's my take anyway... The Star Wars line's put out its finest figures in, well, really the 10+ years the line's been out now, at least as far as I'm concerned. I personally love the new Jedi Luke, actually. I think it's superior to the last Jedi Luke too, but really when you think about it, the last one and this one give people the best of both worlds. If you want one with less articulation and what's there is less noticeable, the last Luke is outstanding for that. If you want one with more articulation, the new one's your bag... Hasbro delivered to both crowds then. A rarity.

[Morian Miner]

But really, can you have it both ways? In one sentence you're saying glue in the removable clips (a feature I love personally, as an adult collector who enjoys "features" on his toys), but at the same time you're saying you should cut back on articulation on some toys (a feature that, as an adult collector I still enjoy, but articulation IS something kids like equally).

What I was saying is the collectors keep clamoring for all these details (30 pts. articulation! removeable clips!). But, they're losing sight of the fact it takes away from the figure.What good is added articulation to a kid if the figure is prone to breakage, or lost parts? When SW was the only major player, kids were find with 5 pts of articulation. Yeah, superarticulation is great, if it is done right. That means well hidden, tight joints that don't flop around or delicate pegs that break when moved. Add to that the manufacturers figuring out proper cure times on plastics and paints before assembling figure so joints don't freeze. The buyer shouldn't have to spend time boiling and working with a figure to make sure something doesn't break the first time you move it.

But anyway, to me the problem's the sculpt... Luke's ankles and things can all look fine if the sculpt allows for it. Take into account the Death Star Trooper, who I love as a figure overall, but ultimately his joints are recessed into the sockets nearly as much as they should be, and so they're "noticeable" (best way to put it I guess). Less the fault of the articulation count though, and definitely a sculpting flaw.

Again, if its done right. Some SW figures look great with joints hidden. Others do not. Which has been my gripe on the more recent figures, and why I've cut way back on what I purchase. Too hit and miss on which ones look good, and which ones miss the mark.

And the GI Joes are great examples of manufacturers getting caught up in the "super-poseability" The biggests snafu on them that Hasbro has admited in Q&As and at the convention - the diaper crotch. Of all things to ignore, they didn't think about people wanting to have figures sit in vehicles. How is that not a requirement for toy design (ignoring the unflexible skirts most figures have now days that wipe out hip articulation)? Did they not think collectors would want to put them in old vehicles? Or kids would not want to play with them that way? At least Hasbro listened, and is fixing it. That is one thing I give major, major props to Hasbro on - they are really paying attention to fans regarding the 25th line. At the convetion, they even passed out disassembly instructions to show how to customize the new figures. Nice.

[tosborne3]

The older figures, although not articulated as good as the new ones, still hold a special place in my heart. I love the fact that when you put on their accessories for the most part they stay attached. Unlike our new counterparts. Don't get me wrong, I love the old and the new pretty much the same. I've been collecting from the beginning so I have a bunch of both, but personally the best figures 21st ever came out with was the Falschirmjager and the 101st and 82nd airborne figures. I wish 21st would re-release these as they were some of the best in my opinion. But by all means 21st, please keep bringing out new figures because I love them all. I haven't got the opportunity to buy any of the new Vietnam figures yet but I'm sure I'll love them just the same. 21st has really grown as a company and their quality cannot be matched.

[aae83]

I'm an airplane collector and pose the pilots with the plane: doing a preflight; climbing in; in the seat, canopy open. If I have variations of the same plane displayed, I end up with identical twin pilots, which feels "funny" to me.

As a result, I've been looking to the new figures with the idea of head swapping to make for a little more variety in my pilots. I examine the new figures for well-proportioned headsculpts without extreme expressions or molded-on gear. There are a few out there, but all too frequently the faces are heavily weathered with a red (or other color, or shiny) wash. I have yet to buy an individually packaged figure for that reason.

I like the articulation and sculpts of the new figures over the older ones, but the weathering seems excessive. It would be nice to have the figures with clean faces that we, ourselves, could make dirty, as needed.

On a related but slightly different note, since I display my planes parked, I prefer to have the goggles off the pilots face. The newer pilots mostly have goggles off. I know there are other members who prefer the goggles down. Maybe it would be good to have a few pilot sculpts with goggles in alternate positions, for variety.

Just an opinion, for the little it's worth.

-- aae

[bird]

i want reissues of the US paras and the fallschrimjager paras
i got one set of each whereas ideally i'd love to have more

also it might be good to see the 1st series reissued, reminded me of the italian campaign more than anything esle was that right, the big red 1??
yeah so i'd like to see those again but with better articulation, i actually am a fan of the new articulation and premolded poses for the Vietnam line
i'd like to see the old vietnam figs also reissued.

[newwavepop]

OH MY GOD! i thought i was the only one.i love the version americans and germans i love the version paras and fallschrimjagers, i love the version 1 vietnam figures.
i thought the market garden and marines were so boring looking i didnt buy any.
and i think the new vietnam are the same, so boring and identical i have no interest at all.i hope the platoon are good when they show up.

i liked the d day figures and japanese but still prefer the series one early guys.
i dont know those first guys just looked cooler to me and they all looked different,those marines all look exactly the same to me and the market garden all looked exactly the same to me and now these new vietnam all look exactly the same to me.

[MG-42]

....... and all the Japanese look exactly the same to me.

v MG

[newwavepop]

agreed, i only bought the 2 upper ranked ones and 1 of the other guys because the rest looked exactly the same.

[lablksmith]

The old ones are what caught my eye around 2000. They reminded me of stuff I had as a kid only better.