21st Century's first F-86 photos are up at area-21

Moth · Post by **Moth** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 5:34 pm

There are pre-production photos of the Sabre at area-21, take a look.

I wish they would show the MIG-15

Sabrefan · Post by **Sabrefan** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 5:56 pm

That F-86 will be some nice. I really like how they routed the intake under the pilot just like the real Sabre. And the gun detail looks great. Put me down for a few!

tmanthegreat · Post by **tmanthegreat** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 6:38 pm

Wow! Kind of makes me wonder why I got the AT version, though that one is still very nice. I like the deep intakes and this should have a very well done pilot. Should I double up on the F-86 now? The Mig-15 should be spectacular as well - and that is one I will surely get!

Website · Post by **Teamski** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 6:46 pm

Looks awesome!! Another F-86 to add to the collection!!

-Ski

Jericoeagle1 · Post by **Jericoeagle1** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 6:53 pm

Competition is a good thing. I wonder what the next "improvement" will be? Working Afterburners?

Folkwulfe · Post by **Folkwulfe** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 7:00 pm

It looks like 21C has taken on a later model F-86 than AT. It definately has the 6-3 wing along with the leading edge "gloves" that had to be removed to open the ammo bay access hatch. That makes this one an F, G, or K version. Anyone for bets on how long before it makes the shelves?

tko211 · Post by **tko211** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 7:06 pm

Everyone saw the same thing I did.... The deep nose intake! I was so happy to see that nose shot when it came in this afternoon. I have been told the MiG-15 is the same! Can't wait till we see that one too.

21st infomred me that continual coverage will happen from here on out with these 2 airplanes. Both aircraft are actually much further along than what is currently being shown. I can't wait to see what the schemes will be. I am told that both projects are closer than people might think, including me. I guess 21st has been pretty hush hush about these 2 for obvious reasons.

Roy also told me that the Guns and ammo feeds shown here are NOT the final version, and that the detail is much improved. Fans are going to see these various steps already taken on these bad boys!

tmanthegreat · Post by **tmanthegreat** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 7:22 pm

So no opening guns and ammochutes?

Morian Miner · Post by **Morian Miner** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 7:28 pm

Oh boy, continuing coverage

Just a little skeptical on that based on 21C track records. Just let us know when its on the water.

Negativity aside, the pictures are very nice. They're really teasing us by not showing the MIG first. Really can't wait to see at least some pictures of that one. And any ideas when we'll get a peek at the pilots?

And as for the obvious reasons 21C has kept the project under wraps, I wonder what the secrecy may have done to hurt the project? Meaning, if these pictures were out a few months ago, would some people have put off buying the AT Saber?

tko211 · Post by **tko211** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 7:29 pm

Yes there are opening gun access and ammo feeds, as shown... However these pictures do not reflect the final level of detail. In short, Roy wanted more detail in this area in particular the ammo feeds themselves.

I think it is great to be able to see those 6 .50 cal guns! totally cool!

flpickupman · Post by **flpickupman** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 7:35 pm

So who wants a Navy or USMC F3J Fury to go along with the F-86?

Sabrefan · Post by **Sabrefan** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 8:19 pm

I am glad they are making the F model of the F-86. I am looking forward to it and the Mig-15.

Quixote511 · Post by **Quixote511** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 5:09 am

I think the 21st model will be my table sitter and the AT model will be my ceiling hanger. Having an adversary will be great; I can't wait for that Mig.
Aaron

thetatau87 · Post by **thetatau87** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 7:46 am

Can someone take pictures of the AT Sabre from the same angles as the 21c shots. 21c claims that the intake and exhaust are much more realistic with deeper ducting, but I've never seen any shots of these areas of the AT model for comparison.

The detailed gun lockers are a bigger deal to me than improved intake and exhaust ducts, but every improvement in accuracy and detail is appreciated. The detailed guns are more than enough to make me opt for the 21c Sabre over the AT.

Tinman · Post by **Tinman** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 10:16 am

Uh-oh! Looks like a winner to me. The intake and exhaust depth mean a lot in my book.

tmanthegreat · Post by **tmanthegreat** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 11:42 am

The AT version does not have any depth to the intake or exhaust pipe. You can't really tell when looking at a distance, though 21c's improvements are pretty cool.

Birddog · Post by **Birddog** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 1:35 pm

Another great addition............can't wait to SEE that Mig-15 much less HOLD it in my hands..

thetatau87 · Post by **thetatau87** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 1:36 pm

Is the AT F-86 similar to the BBI F-18? I was pretty disappointed at the lack of depth on the Hornet. None of the pictures online show the intakes or exhaust nozzles and no one mentioned it in their gripes about the Hornet. All I heard were raves about it. It is pretty cool, but it does have serious shortcomings in the accuracy department and looks rather toyish in several areas.

Everyone seems to be raving about the AT Sabre and giving it 5/5 stars. It seems that a 5/5 is just a "best yet" rating and not a "best possible" rating. In my opinion a 5/5 would indicate a perfect model with no accuracy discrepancies between the actual aircraft and the model. That seems not to be the case at all with 1:18 because each model that comes out makes major improvements and sets the bar higher. Does that mean that the AT F-86 is no longer a 5/5 because the 21c is more accurate? What about down the road when AT makes a 2nd run at the F-86 and outdoes 21c?

tko211 · Post by **tko211** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 3:00 pm

I have to agree that the open ducted intake was a make or break for both the F-86 and the MiG-15. This detail is so critical on these to airplanes given that they are on the very front of the nose of the aircraft as a focal point. (So being that both of these have the open nose is a huge WIN in my book)

FYI- I received just one "top secret" nose shot of the MiG-15 first test shot today from 21st, confirming it will be a deep open duct as well. All I can say is WOW! There isn't much else in the picture but it does look pretty sweet so far! 21st is still keeping pictures of the MiG-15 under wraps just for now. As a couple detial points needed to be locked down before making a commitment to fans.

All I can tell you for certain is that the pictures of the F-86F shown on AREA-21 are of "first shots" menaing it is in plastic and not a prototype! And these photos are older than the current status of the project. So what does it all mean? The F-86F from 21st is far closer than many might think!

It is going to be a huge year for 1:18 scale 21st aircraft... Great time to be a fan!

P-51D new mold
P-51D new mold with GUN BAYS
Avenger
F-86F
MiG-15
Me-262

Black_Dragon_One · Post by **Black_Dragon_One** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 12:28 am

tko

what is wrong with the 21st wing

the leading edge does not seem to be there or it just me..

eddie372 · Post by **eddie372** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 1:43 am

Although the 21-C F-86 will be the 'F' series, from which the leading edge slots were removed for aerodynamic reasons, the wing of the Admiral Toys Sabre is unbeatable with its retractable slots. As models go, the looks of a "dirty" wing (flaps and slots deployed), is just too beautiful to ignore. A "clean" wing may be more efficient for combat maneuvering, but it is no match for the looks of a wing with all its feathers showing.

From the pictures posted in the 21c website, it appears as if the air brake walls and the piston for its hydraulic mechanism, are too thick. Hopefuly these are some of the re-engineering items that have been resolved in the production run. The turning nose wheel will be a nice touch, as well as the visible guns, but in my opinion, they do not compensate for the absence of slots.

Jericoeagle1 · Post by **Jericoeagle1** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 2:38 am

I'm glad its an F model. I like to have variety. Thats why I was a bit sad when 21st chose to redo the "D" model Mustang. I really wish it would have been a "B". Once you have one, what good is another unless you like the different schemes. Same with BBI doing the Corsair, a latter model would have been great.

But to be fair, it is nice to compare the two (now three) companies simular aircraft side by side. In the air force I came to see that every aircraft looks different even if it is the same type and model. Over time panels get replaced, repainting occurs, the maintenance changes some aircraft are cleaner some not. To set different versions of a say the P-51 next to each other you get that sense as well that each aircraft is an individual item.

Quixote511 · Post by **Quixote511** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 7:39 am

Well put Jerico
Aaron

tko211 · Post by **tko211** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 8:16 am

For Black Dragon:

Interesting question:
There is nothing wrong with the 21st wing on the Sabre. The 21st Sabre is an F model. The F model was the warbird that fought the war and finally made it a worth opponent of the MiG-15. The F version hard wing does not have any leading edge slots in real life thus the 21st bird does not as well.

It is this version that saw the most combat and has the most option for correct historical paint schemes. The choice, and ommission of edge slats is both intentional and correct.

Sabrefan · Post by **Sabrefan** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 8:47 am

Will the Mig-15 and the F-86F both come out at the same time? Or will the F-86F be first?

Small Scale Military Headquarters

21st Century's first F-86 photos are up at area-21

21st Century's first F-86 photos are up at area-21

F-86

21C F-86 Sabre