LOOK INSIDE!!!!!!!!!!!!! WE NEED YOUR HELP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

VMF115 · Post by **VMF115** » Thu Feb 05, 2009 10:20 pm

Tambo wrote:Walmart has over 1/4th of the entire Nations toy market. I do not think they will pull everything...now I do believe they are going to go nuts on the new toy regulations.

I was told by a corporate executive that this is what they want to do.
they want to build an assortment around the 3 year old child and his mother...oh star wars will still be sold but I bet it will be the galactic heroes kind......

IF you are an adult no cool toy collectibles for you!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I don't think they will pull the stuff of the selves it will be more like not reordering it when they run out.

Rowsdower · Post by **Rowsdower** » Thu Feb 05, 2009 10:35 pm

Stug45 wrote:
Don't forget the wrestling figures

Or the Drangonballz Z or whatever the hell that crap is called.

And they are making a killing with Transformers. I was gonna pick up the new Starscream but saw they just jacked the prices up from $9 to $12-something. Screw that!

Booga · Post by **Booga** » Thu Feb 05, 2009 10:58 pm

April Fools?

Birddog · Post by **Birddog** » Thu Feb 05, 2009 11:00 pm

VMF115 wrote:
Stug45 wrote:When is wm going to start doing this??
don't know when they will do the reformatting of the toy department all I know is they are planing it

As for 21st century toys no new orders are being planed this year is what a person from WallMart told me. there will be no more new 21st items at WM unless we act...and who knows that might be 21st death.......

I think we have to come to grips with what the reality is, Wal-Mart has more than likely dropped 21st Century toys. Does this mean the Death of 1/18 as a hobby or by other manufacturers?

No

Does this mean no more 1/18 military products?

No. Maybe not in Wal-Mart for the cheap prices many have relied on in the past, but I seriously don't think that 1/18 military toys are dead. Granted, there may be fewer releases over time with higher price tags.

Admiral Toys is proof that 1/18 isn't dead. What FOV has and is doing at Target is a good sign to me as well. I've heard that the FOV line has exceeded the expectations that Unimax had.

Does this mean no more GI Joe toys or Star Wars toys in the 1/18 market?

No. This scale has just about become a standard for action figures. There has been a huge shift across many toy lines this year to go to this scale. Terminator, Marvel Superheroes, Hellboy, and Star Trek to name a few. Retail giants like Wal-Mart, Target, and Toys R Us are putting money into having their own exclusives through some of these lines.

I'm just not buying the whole bit about Wal-Mart dropping the more collectable part of brands like GI Joe and Star Wars.

vmf214 · Post by **vmf214** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 12:06 am

"Wolf, wolf!"

Just don't believe it. But, in the chance it were to happen, just coz WM quits carrying don't mean the hobby is gonna die...lets get a grip here.

sluff · Post by **sluff** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 12:17 am

Didn't WalMart kill the GI Joe line from the 80's? They Told Hasbro they want brighter colors, less war like toys and added play features. This would really suck if toy companies start doing what the stores tell them too.

vmf214 · Post by **vmf214** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 12:25 am

With the amt of greenage Hasbro pulls in with all venues not just wm I seriously doubt they'd do that again, not in the internet age. They may just to appease someone like wm but they wouldn't kill a line just to make some morons in suits happy. I think too many give too much credit to places like wm when the online etailers are the ones that are gonna save the a$$ of 1/18 imo

.

immeww2 · Post by **immeww2** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 12:42 am

On the one hand, I really don't care if WM continues to carry collectible toys since their history of retailing the merchandise was horrible from the get go. On the other hand, if the other manufacturers are indeed keeping score of what another retailer is doing with regard to collectible toys then something should be done. I tend to lean towards doing nothing though as I share the belief with those that feel that the collectible toys will never die and that they will find other avenues for reaching the consumer.

sluff · Post by **sluff** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 12:57 am

I agree about the etailers and part of me really does not care about walmarts choice because my choice for the majority of my collecting (Star Wars and Transformers) has been Target, they have better distribution, and better exclusives, they also offer their exclusives online in case you can't find them around you. When was the last time you saw any 32x or XD at walmart.com, not to mention in the Chicago area I never saw the Avengers, ME-262's, Spitfires (both scales), P-38's or the later Stukas but on my drive to Dallas in November I stopped in a Walmart outside Little Rock and on the top shelf above me are dozens of 32x Spitfires and the shelf in front of me has an ME 262 nightfighter? So again maybe Walmart can shoot themselves in the foot one more time I will stick with MD and the deals we find here among the people that truly love this hobby

VMF115 · Post by **VMF115** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 1:34 am

WM carries a lot of clout if WM says military collectibles is dead in their store do you really think that target and TRU will not notice that...don't you think the major manufacturers will notice that and not willing to make anything as a military collectible...its not cheap to make the molds. why invest in expensive molds if you can't get a big retailer to cover the cost..

And what about growth in the hobby when there is no military collectables be sold in big retailer stores..........the fact is there will be no real growth but a trend of negative growth...not enough new people coming in to replace the older collectors leaving the hobby......

How to do build the interest in this hobby, if the potential hobbyist has no idea that there are 1/18th or 1/32 tanks and airplanes.......

There will be a certain amount of people that accidentally stumble on to the hobby...but will it be enough to justify the manufacturers to spend their capital on new molds. will independent etailers drop money down on a shipment wort tens of thousands of dollars that has very little exposures on the mass market...
You need new growth and WM brings that to the table....

One needs to fight in what they believes in.... even if all you have to do is write two emails telling WM how much you like military collectibles....Its simple........

Is it that hard to try and do something

Or are you going to let the chips lay where they fall and do nothing????????

OK Wm sucks there distribution sucks and if it was not for board members here you would have never gotten one unless you waited till it showed up on Wm or evil-bay....

But you can not deny that WM gave 21st century the exposure it needed to grow...

BTW WM is where I found out about this hobby......it was a few years latter before I bought my first one but I kept looking at them till I bought 1, that led to 2, then 10, then 30, and on...........................

Lets say every one here emailed folks that emailed WM and we got said mumber 1000----20000 "most likely 20 at the rate were going" it still better then not doing anything at all....would it do any good ...maybe not but does it hurt...no... I Would rather try something then not to try...

AMERICAN_GRENADIER · Post by **AMERICAN_GRENADIER** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 8:25 am

it is true that wm has made a decision to move away from many military toys. they started years ago when they wouldnt sell anything that had a swastika on it. i spoke with a manager at my local wm and he received a message that many items military toys,model kits and toy guns would no longer be offered. he also said contacting wm by email does work. if enough people do it.

Ta-152 · Post by **Ta-152** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 9:29 am

sluff wrote:Didn't WalMart kill the GI Joe line from the 80's? They Told Hasbro they want brighter colors, less war like toys and added play features. This would really suck if toy companies start doing what the stores tell them too.

They already do.

coreystinson · Post by **coreystinson** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 10:12 am

vmf214 wrote:I think too many give too much credit to places like wm when the online etailers are the ones that are gonna save the a$$ of 1/18 imo .

Not quite. It's you guys, the consumer, who are either going to save 1/18 scale, or not.

What I would propose is that e-tailers work with distributors and/or manufacturers to offer consumer-funded production runs - i.e. pre-production pre-orders.

A price will have to be established along with a production run number such that a profit can be made by all involved, on the first color scheme. That may mean a new 1/18 scale bird will cost US$150 or more (I can hear the wails and moans already). Retailers solicit the product for 3-6 months.

If enough orders are received, the product goes into production. If not enough orders received, the concept it scrapped. It's a "put the money where the mouth is" concept.

I suspect the manufacturers already believe this won't work.

In any case, I doubt this idea is feasible in the current economic climate but might be workable in the future.

MG-42 · Post by **MG-42** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 10:18 am

.......... "Still debatable , never the less".

Mitch v MG

vmf214 · Post by **vmf214** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 11:18 am

"But you can not deny that WM gave 21st century the exposure it needed to grow... "

And look where it got them

Dilusional to think WM helped 21st in any shape, way, or form. Especially when they put their product on clearance almost immediately at several hundred stores across the nation. Do some research on how WM pays it's distributors and it's plain to see WM ultimately contributed greatly to their demise. Yeah it was great to get a Cobra for $15 or less, and look where it got us in the end...

"...its not cheap to make the molds"

I think a few of us know that first hand. But, people don't care what it cost someone to make something, all they want is a "deal", just human nature.

Birddog · Post by **Birddog** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 11:49 am

coreystinson wrote:
What I would propose is that e-tailers work with distributors and/or manufacturers to offer consumer-funded production runs - i.e. pre-production pre-orders.

A price will have to be established along with a production run number such that a profit can be made by all involved, on the first color scheme. That may mean a new 1/18 scale bird will cost US$150 or more (I can hear the wails and moans already). Retailers solicit the product for 3-6 months.

If enough orders are received, the product goes into production. If not enough orders received, the concept it scrapped. It's a "put the money where the mouth is" concept.

I think this is an idea that should be approached to some degree. The problem I see is getting people to agree on the subject.

Dauntless · Post by **Dauntless** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 11:56 am

What no Star Wars and GI Joe?
Toddlers only?

This will go over like a lead balloon.

Idiotic behaviour on the part of WM, but then again, a lot of companies are making stupid out-of-touch decisions lately.

coreystinson · Post by **coreystinson** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 12:17 pm

Birddog wrote:
I think this is an idea that should be approached to some degree. The problem I see is getting people to agree on the subject.

True. So, we'll wait about three years w/ little or no product available to buy, and perhaps people will be more amenable to the concept?

That still doesn't address overall economic feasibility, that's another question, that may have to simply be explored empirically.

tko211 · Post by **tko211** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 12:27 pm

Having seen 21C's inner workings a little I can tell you this. WM was a huge anchor for 21C and that account was a huge source of revenue that funded MANY of the products we now have in our collections today. So I must say that if we would like to see more in the future from 21C WM is most certainly needed!

Regardless of what anyone thinks of WM and whatever policies they have the fact that 21C makes such cool toys and so many of them is directly influenced by mass retail orders and support. To that point- I would agree that if there is an opportunity to "write your congressmen" or in this case a WM executive that might appreciate our views as customers... Well lets do it. I miss these toys too.

flyboy_fx · Post by **flyboy_fx** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 3:10 pm

OK WHAT DO I DO.

VMF115 · Post by **VMF115** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 4:16 pm

flyboy_fx wrote:OK WHAT DO I DO.

send two emails to the people

Andrew.Tucker at wal-mart.com

Laura.Phillips at wal-mart.com

please put in the @ I removed it.

AMERICAN_GRENADIER · Post by **AMERICAN_GRENADIER** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 6:27 pm

without a doubt WM can make or break a toy company. look at the major toy stores. in the mid 90's TRUS was badly hurt by WM. Wm sold many of the leading toys for less than cost to drive the folks to thier stores. not until toy companies offered exclusives to chain toy stores did they get some breathing room. its like the old saying LIVE BY WM DIE BY WM!

Jay · Post by **Jay** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 7:35 pm

excuse my ignorance...but why cant a retailer like K-mart take some on board (plus k-mart is more "global"). Feels like 21c put all their eggs into one basket

paulpratt · Post by **paulpratt** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 8:43 pm

The honest truth is that none of us know what exactly is going on within 21st century. So everyone right now is overeacting. On top of that, these are just toys, so no one needs to panic to begin with. I'm sure we'll all find another swirling vortex of death to dump our wheelbarrows of money into.

I would wager that collectible toys, like those made by 21st century, simply don't sell at all in comparison with other toys within large retailers like wal-mart. Despite what we feel, kids are toys' primary target audience, and within retailers like wal-mart kids comprise the largest buying group (shocking, i know).

The death of 1:18 scale "collectibles" happens like this (this causes prices to hit rock bottom and destroy the hobby in mass market):
Parent picks up a 21st century toy on a whim because little Davy wanted something cool for his birthday. Mom and Pop open the awesome 1:18 scale P-51 up, and are blown away by the quality, but the minute little Davy picks it up, the landing gear fall out, bust off, and the cockpit is broken the instant the figure is put in.
Mom and Pop immediately swear off buying from that "toy" company again. Word spreads, products don't sell, they go on clearance, nerds rejoice, toys go away due to not having a profit margin, nerds get upset
(nerd is a term of endearment here).

Things like this aren't going to work in stores like wal-mart and they are now, as a result, avoiding these "collectible toys" like the plague. Honestly, rightfully so. They don't fit within their target demographic: 5-12 year old kids, namely boys. No matter what people think, star wars and the like are not going anywhere. They sell the best in this demographic.

Target does better with 1:18 scale because, as i mentioned in my previous post, Forces of Valor toys are more durable, period. They can be played with by kids. They also have a line of figures to support them. Parents dig durability in a toy. It makes them feel less terrible about wasting hard earned money on what essentially can be melted down into a pile of molten nothing.

Until the toys can deliver durability for a moderate price at a mass retailer nothing is ever going to "take off" for this hobby.

But that is my opinion*.

*Disclaimer: opinions are not based on fact and don't necessarily represent the views of everyone, including myself.

Jay · Post by **Jay** » Fri Feb 06, 2009 11:04 pm

valid points paul. I guess there in lies the problem (or paradox) . When is a toy not a toy? I think hobby stores and such should be the main focus (that includes toy stores, becuase they can also carry more "adult" toys ie gas powered rc cars and such). I guess this kinda leads into another thought - advertising. If it hadn't been for a chance encounter. Then a search on google, I would never have known 21c existed. They basically have 5% exposure here in NZ at the moment (as far as I know). What kind of advertising / exposure do they have in the states? Do they advertise in model magazines?