Since GI Joe has made a big come back

VMF115 · Post by **VMF115** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 3:24 pm

Since GI Joe has made a big come back do you guys think it hurt the 1/18th military items?

a few years ago I was in WM and this guy early 40's was looking at the 1/18th 21st century toys planes and tanks..now this was before I got in to collecting them I said they look cool..he said they look like some cheap knock of of GI Joe...I was like k what ever...

but do you guys think GI joe has taken the wind out of sale from 21st and bbi? Me thinks Hasbro answer to 1/18th military toys was t reissued their line of GI Joes.

what do you guys think??????????????

Dauntless · Post by **Dauntless** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 3:36 pm

Well, I'm thinking that the only way we get something close to realistic like XD is for Hasbro GI Joe to evolve beyond the kid stage. More like their 1:6 scale stuff a few years ago.

This I think could happen with the "PG" cartoon series GI Joe "Resolute" or perhaps the live action movie later on.

I just take one look at their vehicles and think how much better the XD stuff is. I've only bought a couple of them. The ones that aren't totally rediculous.

I really don't know what else can spark interest in military toys without some big budget Hollywood movie with some cool hardware, or a regular TV series. Or History teachers.
Hopefully there's more coming down the pipe in the movie department.

I don't really think GI Joe has hurt the military toys that much, except for more lines of toys taking up more shelfspace. If anything, XD could only help the GI Joe line. Especially if Hasbro started making historically accurate military toys like their 12" line only in 3 3/4 or 1:18.

Once the big boys start making successful lines of military toys, other companies start doing it.GI Joe really started the whole thing, but they never took 1:18 scale much beyond their cartoon toys, and that's where 21st Century Toys came in and saw an opportunity.

STUKA · Post by **STUKA** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 4:18 pm

Id say it helped - and if stores used product placement at a maximum things would be better - If WM had placed XD right next to Starwars or Gijoe they would have sold more - maybe companies deal with WM we will give you product A if you place it next to Bob te builder etc.

Birddog · Post by **Birddog** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 5:06 pm

I don't think GI Joe has hurt 1/18 military items at all. I think GI Joe and 1/18 military items have helped each other in some ways. I believe Hasbro saw another toy line that has a distinct fan base among kids and adults and like they have done with Star Wars and Transformers are cashing in on it.

I frequent this forum and a few GI Joe collector forums. From the threads and posts that I see over on the GI Joe forums, most GI Joe collectors seem to be just that....GI Joe collectors. There are a few that collect both and most of them I have noticed are members of this forum too. Me being one of them.

The problem GI Joe collectors usually have with 1/18 military items is that they dwarf nearly every GI Joe vehicle that has a realistic base to it. Hard to put an X-30 Conquest (the forward swept wing GI Joe plane) or a Cobra Rattler (Cobra plane that is based off of the A-10) next to a bbi F-16 or F-18 and have it make any sense. It's down right comical to me. It would look like a Finch attacking an Eagle or vice versa.

Some ground vehicles aren't bad though. For instance, a Vamp mixed in with some Humvees and Mutts doesn't look bad at all. Just depends on the colors of the vehicles and your tolerance in my opinion. Always have to allow a little bit of room for new prototype developement in the field along with battle tested equipment don't you?...

On top of all this is the cost of 1/18 military items. They cost way more than what most GI Joe fans seem to be willing to pay. However, I have noticed that when someone on a GI Joe forum who doesn't normally collect 1/18 military items goes out of their way to buy one, they usually go ga-ga over it.

With the release of the 25th Anniversary line, the figures fit fairly well in my opinion when it comes to heights and proportions. Way better than the old ARAH version I grew up with. Some of their outfits/uniforms are definitely over the top and no where near any military dress code, but hey, they're a highly trained and daring counter terroist team.....

.

I just recieved some of the figures that are based on the new GI Joe Resolute animation Dauntless mentioned and in my opinion the Duke figure is a great fit with the bbi and FOV modern figure releases. His whole look screams Spec Ops. The Cobra Trooper isn't bad either except for his small feet. From what has been seen in the animation preview, the concept art, and the interviews with writers and such, the Resolute side of GI Joe may bring us these characters in a more realistic modernized look. That would be the best of both worlds in my opinion. I'll try and post some pics of Resolute Duke with some bbi and FOV modern figures tonight if I get a chance.

AMERICAN_GRENADIER · Post by **AMERICAN_GRENADIER** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 5:30 pm

its just a different market. i dont even look at that kid stuff. it doesnt even compare to Dragon action 18,FOV or 21C XD

STUKA · Post by **STUKA** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 7:53 pm

when I first saw XD I was more interested in GiJoe and the 1:6 figures - but it was the XD Bradley that made me get into the armor - Id passed on panthers and Tigers - The Bradley was perfect for my GiJoe's finally a vehicle that wasnt too small - well the rest is history here I am.

Ta-152 · Post by **Ta-152** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 9:12 pm

GI Joe lives to crew my 1:18 vehicles.

hotrodrock · Post by **hotrodrock** » Mon Dec 08, 2008 10:01 pm

VMF115 wrote:Since GI Joe has made a big come back do you guys think it hurt the 1/18th military items?

a few years ago I was in WM and this guy early 40's was looking at the 1/18th 21st century toys planes and tanks..now this was before I got in to collecting them I said they look cool..he said they look like some cheap knock of of GI Joe...I was like k what ever...

but do you guys think GI joe has taken the wind out of sale from 21st and bbi? Me thinks Hasbro answer to 1/18th military toys was t reissued their line of GI Joes.

what do you guys think??????????????

Think the guy was a little confused and had it backwards. I see lots of GI JOe just sitting and not selling. Back in the mid and late 90's, I bought all of their 1/6 figures when they started making them again. The heads were all the same but they had great uniforms and the if you remember, the boxes were the small boxes that were easy to display without taking the figures out. The 1/6 they sell today are too cartoonish for me. I think 21st and Dragon saw how well the Joe 1/6 figures were selling and thats when they got big into the 1/6 figures. Not sure why 21st stopped completely making the 1/6 figures.

Birddog · Post by **Birddog** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 7:48 am

Here are the pictures of the GI Joe Resolute Duke figure (armed with a Marauder M4) along with FOV and bbi figures. A 21st Century Soft Top Humvee is in the background:

coreystinson · Post by **coreystinson** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 8:32 am

VMF115 wrote:Since GI Joe has made a big come back do you guys think it hurt the 1/18th military items?

Nope.

What has hurt the 1:18 scale line is:

a) The economy

and

b) The big box retailer syndrome that put unrealistically low expectations on pricing, pricing that couldn't continue indefinitely. Now that the big box players are out the real economies of scale come home to roost, and a significant percentage of people have to leave the hobby because they either can't afford the product or aren't willing to pay for it.

STUKA · Post by **STUKA** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 8:58 am

also the big stores, save TRU, place the large item XD on clearance so fast they end up with customers waiting for the lower price - customers like me!
Then when the stores actually sit back and hold their regular price the customer still waits for it to go on clearance - even though gas money and time was expended while waiting.

so basically what I'm saying is I did it! I hurt XD! I waited and waited for the spitfire at WM to go down in price, then I haggled with the manager and got a few more dollars taken off - It was meee

I passed when the P-40 was $39.99 when the 104 starfighter was $29 I still waited - when the Avenger was down to $25 I knew I could hold for another week - I finally gave in and picked it up at $15 and returned it and bought it again when it was down to $10
cries*

It was meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

Scene from XD monologues

Birddog · Post by **Birddog** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 9:13 am

coreystinson wrote:
VMF115 wrote:Since GI Joe has made a big come back do you guys think it hurt the 1/18th military items?
Nope.

What has hurt the 1:18 scale line is:

a) The economy

and

b) The big box retailer syndrome that put unrealistically low expectations on pricing, pricing that couldn't continue indefinitely. Now that the big box players are out the real economies of scale come home to roost, and a significant percentage of people have to leave the hobby because they either can't afford the product or aren't willing to pay for it.

I think this one (b) says a whole lot. The prices were great while they lasted, but the reality is we should've paid way more than what we did for the 1/18 items we have. Demanding more for less doesn't always work out for the best in the long run.

Tambo · Post by **Tambo** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 9:38 am

I admit I buy many of the new GI joe figures. I will not buy any with Neon paint jobs or the corny tigerforce, battleforce or any kind of force. The vehicles mostly i pass on unless they are really cool. I agree the Jets and choppers are way off scale and look stupid next to any XD. I'd like to repaint a MIG with Cobra colors..that would fit in much better.

coreystinson · Post by **coreystinson** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 9:46 am

Birddog wrote: I think this one (b) says a whole lot. The prices were great while they lasted, but the reality is we should've paid way more than what we did for the 1/18 items we have. Demanding more for less doesn't always work out for the best in the long run.

Yep, this combined with the economic climate creates a consumer expectation that is way out of line with actual production costs. Having said this, I predict the following: we will see no more 1:18 scale items for some years, that includes the aircraft Admiral was working on, the 21st Century King Tiger, the FOV Stryker, etc. Only exception is if a major retailer decides to pick any of them up, which I doubt will occur. Or, we might see the occasional re-deco of old tooling, but even this I doubt. For the timebeing, I think 1:18 scale has run its course at major retail and cannot be sustained in this economic climate by the hobby marketplace alone.

Dauntless · Post by **Dauntless** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 9:55 am

It was you Stuka!!! You did it!!!

Actually I paid some small prices there at the end. Both the Taylor and Welch, I think I paid $20 to $25 for, along with a couple of FW-190's.

I paid full pop for two Avengers when they came out $79), then when they went down to $25, I kinda felt burned, but hey that's the way it goes.

I'm liking those "Resolute" GI Joe figures! (Thanks for the pics Birddog!) The 21st Hummer is perfect for them.
Unless they somehow time-warp to the past (hey that might make a good story line) I don't see a chance of any WWII vehicles though.

BBI might see fit to re-issue some helicopters like the Blackhawk.

STUKA · Post by **STUKA** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 10:30 am

the FOV tanks seem to sell well at target only one really sitting is the Bradley - the abrams and M-4s turn over pretty quickly at two of the three targets in my area- back in the day the tanks sold well at WM - It was when the clearanced them they stopped selling - people waiting for the lower price. The planes sold well until we got overstocked with 190s and p-51s.

pcsguy88 · Post by **pcsguy88** » Fri Dec 12, 2008 2:25 am

I was thinking about this same thing a few days ago. It is possible, but sounds like a lot of us only discovered BBI, 21C and Bravo while looking for vehicles for our new 25th Anv figures. I had not collected any figures since the 80's, but the original boxsets made me start. I've sold most of the crazy stuff and only buy the realistic guys that fit with the vehicles. Yes, my Joeverse has been bastardized.

pcsguy88 · Post by **pcsguy88** » Fri Dec 12, 2008 2:36 am

Some customs I sold:

SnakeEyes make great special ops:

Love the choppers:

pcsguy88 · Post by **pcsguy88** » Fri Dec 12, 2008 2:40 am

Those 25th Anv figures even led me to 1/16 rc's:

And you have to keep a little fantasy:

Small Scale Military Headquarters

Since GI Joe has made a big come back

Since GI Joe has made a big come back

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