swastica or not to swastika

[pickelhaube]

I just got some 21st 1/18 scale planes in and a couple of them have swastikas on the tails. They actuly look very good on the tail. For historical accuracy . Those German planes had them in WW2 so these markings should be on them.
I know the reason why they are not on the planes when they are marketed. I would like to ask this question to the forum members. As far as re-sale is concered does putting the decal on the tail of the plane hurt, help or no way effect the resale value? I have always thought about this and have never put anything on my mint in box planes. Or have been too lazy to do it.
What are you all's opion?

[kduck]

I would say that leaving them mint without the swastikas would be preferable as far as resale value is concerned. However when selling them I would certainly mention that the decals are included. That way you cover the collectors that want items that are "MIB", you cover the crowd that might like the plane but not want to display swastikas and you cover the historical accuracy crowd because they know that the swastikas are they if they want to apply them.

As far as display is concerned I'm a big fan of historical accuracy. I also understand why the retail market requires certain things to be left off but to me it just looks odd when I see a figure that is missing something that should be there. When I see figures like the 21C D-Day figures that obviously depict Waffen SS soldiers it just doesn't look right when the right side collar tab is missing the SS Runes. For that reason I generally add the insignia myself.

[General Blasto]

All of this is due to political correctness.
Another reason is because TRU complain long ago about the Swastica and dropped 21st until 21st dropped the symbol. TRU is owned by a jewish family I believe(or so I've been told). So when 21st dropped the symbol, it dropped it on all their production. We live in a world where down here a person can lose their job at a public utility for having a Confederate flag on their front license plate, yet people can fly the mexican flag above and over the American flag -WTF Too many folks down here hang the mexican flag and PR flag on their mirrors and everywhere else. WHat would happen if I had a Confederate flag or German imperial flag(complete with symbol) hanging from my mirror ??? I'd get pulled over

Yep, it's all about our country being run, or soon to be run by forein bleeding heart liberals Sorry for the rant, but just my 2 cents worth. Da General

[GooglyDoogly]

For re-sale value, I'd say leave the swastika off, so you can truly say that the plane is MIMB (or just plain MIB) It's not really about the swastika or anything. It's just many toy collectors prefer their toys as factory mint as possible.

And as Kduck suggested, just be sure to say that the decals are included. That's always a good option for collectors who may want to display their plane and make it look more historically accurate.

And oh, is it time again to discuss the evil politically-correct Jews that's threatening to ruin German WWII fanboys' fun with their toys by whining about some silly thing that happen 60 years ago?

I mean...seriously, can't they just get over it? I mean...how am I supposed to squeal like a little girl over SS figures and their wonder weapons when these rich Jews (that owns TRU apparently) keep going emotional every time they see something that reminds me of that minor, silly thing called the Holocaust?

I mean...sheesh.

<sarcasm>

[Tambo]

Good, Bad...whatever..It is history and if we hide it we are doomed to repeat it. I like my toys to be as historicaly accurate as possible. Hell I've had people who were offended by the Imperial COG on my Star Wars costumes.

[tmanthegreat]

Hmm... To defend or not to defend the Nazis as per historical accuracy on toys. Get out from in front of your computer, visit Europe and spend some time there (particularly in Germany, France and Poland) and you'll see that opinions are very much different than "lets just forget..."

[pickelhaube]

I kinda wanted to stay away from the evils and connotations of the broken pinwheel. Just wanted to know about putting them on the rear rudder and resale value. But when I do have people over and they see my spiked helmets. I get that ole "oh you collect Nazi stuff" question and I shake my head and go into the shcpiel of those are not Nazi helmets they are Imperial helmets and I get those blank looks because the general public does not know the differance.

[olifant]

I say put them on PH. Any collector who demands a completely stock bird won't want them just because they have been taken out of the box. Plus, to the trained eye those rudders just look empty.

[AlloySkull]

Tman, I'd like to know what you mean. I'm familiar with the view as being extremely negative, but I don't know if you mean they feel just pure hatred or what.

[Jesse James]

From a strictly resale standpoint, I'd say no PH, don't do it... The moment you "alter" the toy, you essentially ruin value to it. Now... That's not to say someone won't appreciate what you did, and want the better accuracy....

For instance if you took a Panzer and put the side skirts on it for accuracy's sake and sold it on Ebay (and you did a good job with the add-ons and paint), someone probably will appreciate that and buy it.

If you are wanting to sell a minty mint version of the toy as it originally was though, altering the Swastika decal on the back is a bad idea... At least to me personally. For me, it's the equivalent of "touching up" some chipped paint on a vintage Star Wars figure and not understanding why someone wouldn't want that. It's essentially been changed.

Other people would say the same thing about an autograph on a baseball card... The card itself may have some significant value (hypothetically), and the autograph may, or may not add value... To some the autograph's worth it, and to others the card was the prize. You see what I mean?

The same could be said for a Star Wars actor's autograph on a carded action figure of that person's character. To some the autograph holds value, to others that's just a Star Wars figure whose cardback is now ruined because the actor signed it.

Anyway... For me, I don't plan resale so I don't collect with that thought in mind. I open everything and if I feel the need to add something for accuracy I'll do it, or just to add something like a little weathering I might do that as well. I've never added a Swastika to the one German fighter I have but the thought did cross my mind just for a little more accuracy. I've never really honestly been bothered to do it though either, so I guess it's just not important to me.

As far as the connotations that go with it though, there is a stigma and it's something that should be expected. Nazis were bad, there's no two ways about that, and their "symbols" invoke emotions in others that, as human beings, you're left to deal with. If you've got the symbols in view in any collection, that's just something to accept I think.

[kduck]

I kinda hate to see this thread devolve into an arguement on political correctness. I actually support 21C's decision to leave certain markings off of some of their products. I also understand why retailers wouldn't want certain things in their stores. These items are sold in toy departments and I'd rather see items that are slightly historically inaccurate than not see them at all. If every German plane they produce has a swastika factory applied on the tail then soon you won't see any german planes available at TRU, Target or WM. The same goes for the insignia on SS figures and other controversial subjects. Those details aren't that hard to add yourself. It just takes a little work.

What we really need is an active cottage industry to supply those items that the big manufacturers can't or won't supply. I know that there are a few items out there that are 1/18 scale or that are slightly out of scale that can be made to work but we really need more companies producing products aimed squarely at 1/18 scale figures and military vehicles. What little that there is that's currently available tends to be rather expensive as there isn't a lot of competition. I think the time will come. IMO 1/18 scale will really catch on if 21C and the retailers get their respective acts together regarding production and distribution. I used to be into 1/48 WWI aircraft modeling and 1/35 military modeling. There was a time when almost anything you bought came from just a few manufacturers but eventually companies realized that there was a demand for more items in the popular aircraft and military scales. Now there are dozens of manufacturers and the cottage industry for aftermarket modeling products is thriving. Within weeks of the release of a highly anticipated model there are sometimes dozens of detailing parts, conversion kits and decal sets available.

[aktiger]

Even if though I don't necessarily agree with the decision to keep the swastikas off the planes, I can't fault them for doing it. What retailer wants a bunch of protesters marching in front of their store because they happen to sell a toy that offended someone?

Now, I am in favor of applying the swastika for historical accuracy, even if it is mint in the box, as long as it is done right. Do some research, make sure the decal is the right size, include any other tail kill stickers, and apply the decals with a master modeler recommended process. In the end I feel it adds value.

[Jesse James]

But once you do it, it's no longer a "mint" toy, and it's no longer "mint in box"... It's now altered. From a toy collecting standpoint that's damaged goods, but from a detail standpoint it's good.

Like I said in my post, you've got two camps that may appreciate and dislike the "addition", and thus may pay or may not pay...

Me personally, I buy without intent to sell, so accuracy is more important to me generally if I am bothered by something. The Swastika's don't generally bother me though, so I've not altered them on anything I own (which about the only thing I would want to is on the ME-109 I have, or my Stuka's I guess). I may consider adding it to Colonel Vogel's armband from the Indiana Jones line though, as it's sort of annoying me the red with just a white circle on his uniform, but that's me. I guess the figure inaccuracies bug me more than the vehicles.

[flyboy]

anybody know of any...they may now be as good as water slide decals but they are easily removed if item to be resold